Irrepressible
Yours Irrespectively,
John
From: ietf-bounces@xxxxxxxx [mailto:ietf-bounces@xxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of Abdussalam Baryun
Sent: Wednesday, October 02, 2013 5:19 AM
To: Michael Richardson
Cc: ietf; tools-discuss@xxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] independant submissions that update standards track, and datatracker
I agree that it should appear in related WG's field or area. I see in IETF we have WGs documents list but not areas' documents list, so the individual document may not be found or discovered. I think any document of IETF should be listed
in its field area or related charter, but it seems like the culture of IETF focusing on groups work not on the IETF documents. For example, when I first joined MANET WG I thought that RFC3753 is related because it is IETF, but in one discussion one participant
did not accept to use that document even though it was related. Fuethermore, some WGs don't comment on related documents to their WG, which I think this should change in future IETF culture (e.g. there was one individual doc that was requested by AD to comment
on by the WG but no respond).
Therefore, IMHO, the IETF is divided by groups with different point of views/documents and they force their WG Adopted-Work to list documents (not all related to Group-Charters), but it seems that managemnet does not see that there is
a division in knowledge or in outputs of the IETF, which a new comer may see it clearly. I recommend to focus/list documents related to Charter, not related to WG adoptions, because all IETF document are examined by IESG.
On Tue, Oct 1, 2013 at 7:29 PM, Michael Richardson <mcr+ietf@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
This morning I had reason to re-read parts of RFC3777, and anything
that updated it. I find the datatracker WG interface to really be
useful, and so I visited
http://datatracker.ietf.org/wg/nomcom/
first. I guess I could have instead gone to:
http://www.rfc-editor.org/info/rfc3777
but frankly, I'm often bad with numbers, especially when they repeat...
(3777? 3737? 3733?)
While http://datatracker.ietf.org/wg/nomcom/ lists RFC3777, and
in that line, it lists the things that update it, it doesn't actually list
the other documents. Thinking this was an error, I asked, and Cindy kindly
explained:
>http://datatracker.ietf.org/wg/nomcom/ lists the documents that were
>published by the NOMCOM Working Group. The NOMCOM Working Group was
>open from 2002-2004, and only produced one RFC, which is RFC 3777.
>
>The RFCs that update 3777 were all produced by individuals (that is,
>outside of the NOMCOM Working Group), and so aren't listed individually
>on the NOMCOM Working Group documents page.
I wonder about this as a policy.
Seeing the titles of those documents would have helped me find what I wanted
quickly (RFC5680 it was)...
While I think that individual submissions that are not the result of
consensus do not belong on a WG page. But, if the document was the result of
consensus, but did not occur in a WG because the WG had closed, I think that
perhaps it should appear there anyway.
--
Michael Richardson <mcr+IETF@xxxxxxxxxxxx>, Sandelman Software Works
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