+1 on for John's response. I will argue with my manager if I think they are wrong and I've gotten positive results from giving managers feedback on their performance. Of course, disagreeing with management won't always get the decision changed, but I've never felt I lost anything by raising the discussion. I've also seen some bad decisions made when someone had good reasons why a decision was wrong but didn't surface them because they didn't feel they could argue with management. IETF participant to IETF leadership isn't the same as employee to manager of course. We are all volunteers collaborating to get good results and if we feel there is a process problem we can discuss it. IETF formalizes this by having open mike sessions for example. A thread on whether there is a problem with the IESG review process is appropriate, IMO. -----Original Message----- From: ietf-bounces@xxxxxxxx [mailto:ietf-bounces@xxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of John C Klensin Sent: Friday, April 12, 2013 3:19 PM To: Abdussalam Baryun; ietf Subject: Re: Purpose of IESG Review --On Friday, April 12, 2013 20:24 +0100 Abdussalam Baryun <abdussalambaryun@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: > How can a memebr of staff in a company argue with the manager > about the manager's decisions or performance? In most successful companies, yes. > Only > Owners/shareholders can question managers and staff. And companies that behave that way don't last very long in rapidly evolving fields... at least unless the managers are endowed with perfect wisdom. It is not an accident that most management schools teach would-be managers that listening --especially to the people on the front lines-- is a very important skill. So, at the risk of generalizing too much... What on earth are you talking about and what experience do you have and use to justify it? john