Re: Failing to convince an IETF WG

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On 9/25/2012 6:32 PM, David Morris wrote:

On Tue, 25 Sep 2012, tglassey wrote:

The IETF needs total transparency and a way to process alternative standards
so that it is not actively involved in anything dark and covert.
Todd
That makes no sense ... something can't be an IETF standard if it doesn't
get created and adopted using The IETF's processes. The word 'standard'
implies the approval of some organization/standards body.
The problem is the IETF Process is not transparent. Most of the vetting happens between parties offlist and no capture of that or the underlying processes in the standards process is in place. When the IETF was a trailing-edge process this wasnt an issue but as it has morphed into a leading edge GSO it is now.
The independant
stream does allow publishing of alternatives to IETF Standards, but that
doesn't make tham alternative standards.
And that is the problem.

The IETF process of today is based on a 'consensus' process from a membership of zero. That in and of itself flies in the face of reason and ethical clarity. If there were formal members who came together in a framework that the IETF administered it would be OK but the process today is too easily abused.
For that some other recognized
group needs to declare it a standard and then it will be An XYZ Group
Standard, not an IETF Standard.
That is the point - the IETF cannot hold the world hostage - it must provide open, provably open at that, access to its processes.

The issue is how to remove the political BS which clouds so many initiatives. The answer is an alternative standard process which has some form or predefined completion such that the standard will just issue. There is no fiefdom here there is no magic castle of the technological demigod to sacrifice a first-borne too here there is just simple and transparent steps which can easily be tracked.

When the journey is completed the standard will automatically issue... no IESG no IAB pain no extra administrative overhead for a bunch of lifer type standards junkies... Just simple and clean access to the standard process.

Todd


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