Re: Consensus Call (Update): draft-weil-shared-transition-space-request

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In message <20111207223526.GJ20780@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, =?utf-8?B?TcOlbnM=?= Nils
son writes:
> Subject: Re: Consensus Call (Update): draft-weil-shared-transition-space-re=
> quest Date: Wed, Dec 07, 2011 at 11:31:11AM -0800 Quoting David Conrad (drc=
> @virtualized.org):
> > Michael,
> >=20
> > On Dec 7, 2011, at 10:39 AM, Michael Richardson wrote:
> > > The CGN space seems like a very good place to use 240.0/10.
> >=20
> > I believe the main driver behind this discussion is the need to deal with=
>  deployed non-field-upgradable CPE that has issues with having RFC 1918 spa=
> ce being assigned on the WAN interface.  I'd guess said hardware would also=
>  likely have issues with 240/4 space being instead.
> =20
> I believe we can narrow the problem with RFC 1918 addresses down to "same
> or overlapping prefix on the outside as inside", rather than assuming
> that any use of 1918 space on the outside interface is detrimental.
> Does anybody know of any evidence to the contrary?=20

This is not a ISP/CUSTOMER problem.  This is a ISP/CUSTOMER/WORK problem.

You have the ISP using 172.16/12
You have the customer using 192.168/16 or 10/8
You have WORK using 172.16/12

Enterpises have choosen to use 172.16/12 for EXACTLY the same reasons
you want ISP to use 172.16/12.  CPE equipment doesn't default to
that range.  Both the enterprise and the ISP don't want to clash
with the employee/customer.

ISP's also need a big enough range that they minimise the number
of times they have to re-use the address range as every re-use
introduces more potential for routing leaks, mis-diagnosis, etc.

In addition to all the RFC 1918 address are for *private* use.
Allocating RFC 1918 address is customers not private use, so are
you also planning to update RFC 1918 to permit this *new* use case.

> Vendor default allocations of RFC1918 to "broadband router" LAN interfaces
> are limited to nets 10 and 192.168. Does anybody know of any evidence to th=
> e contrary?=20
> 
> Therefore, point out a /15 from 172.16.0.0/12 and be done with it. The
> few conflicts arising will fall in two classes:
> 
> a/ People who have knowingly changed their LAN prefix.=20
> 
> b/ Organisations large enough to use _all_ of RFC 1918 inside.=20
> 
> "a" means they can change again. Problem solved.=20
> 
> "b" means that they are large enough to be able to buy public external
> addresses, if they do not already posess swamp space. Problem solved.
> 
> 
> --=20
> M=C3=A5ns Nilsson     primary/secondary/besserwisser/machina
> MN-1334-RIPE                             +46 705 989668
> Now I understand the meaning of "THE MOD SQUAD"!
> 
> --I/5syFLg1Ed7r+1G
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-- 
Mark Andrews, ISC
1 Seymour St., Dundas Valley, NSW 2117, Australia
PHONE: +61 2 9871 4742                 INTERNET: marka@xxxxxxx
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