RE: Re: [mpls] unresolved technical concerns

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Alessandro,

Most of the comments I remember reading were of the form "we don't like MPLS OAM because it has 'major unresolved technical concerns' and draft-bhh is *so* much better".  I.e., they were neither constructive nor actionable.

Thanks,

John

> -----Original Message-----
> From: erminio.ottone_69@xxxxxxxxx [mailto:erminio.ottone_69@xxxxxxxxx]
> Sent: Wednesday, October 19, 2011 1:50 PM
> To: John E Drake; Luyuan Fang (lufang); Alexander Vainshtein;
> D'Alessandro Alessandro Gerardo; Stewart Bryant (stbryant)
> Cc: mpls@xxxxxxxx; ietf@xxxxxxxx
> Subject: R: Re: [mpls] unresolved technical concerns
> 
> What about going into the mailing list and LS logs and read the
> comments
> provided by several service providers before asking for them being
> repeated
> again in a I-D that will fate share with the past comments (i.e.,
> ignored)?
> 
> The comments have been already made. It is now the duty of the party
> which has
> so far ignored them to provide an answer.
> 
> It is also so easy to keep ingnoring drafts and technical comments and
> request
> people to continue to produce drafts
> 
> >----Messaggio originale----
> >Da: jdrake@xxxxxxxxxxx
> >Data: 5-ott-2011 23.20
> >A: "Luyuan Fang (lufang)"<lufang@xxxxxxxxx>, "Alexander
> Vainshtein"<Alexander.
> Vainshtein@xxxxxxxxxxx>, "D'Alessandro Alessandro Gerardo"<alessandro.
> dalessandro@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, "Stewart Bryant
> (stbryant)"<stbryant@xxxxxxxxx>
> >Cc: "mpls@xxxxxxxx"<mpls@xxxxxxxx>, "ietf@xxxxxxxx"<ietf@xxxxxxxx>
> >Ogg: Re: [mpls] unresolved technical concerns
> >
> >That's because it is *so* much easier to just keep mumbling 'major
> unresolved
> technical concerns'.  I expect it is something learned in Yoga class.
> >
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: mpls-bounces@xxxxxxxx [mailto:mpls-bounces@xxxxxxxx] On Behalf
> Of
> >> Luyuan Fang (lufang)
> >> Sent: Wednesday, October 05, 2011 5:11 PM
> >> To: Alexander Vainshtein; D'Alessandro Alessandro Gerardo; Stewart
> >> Bryant (stbryant)
> >> Cc: mpls@xxxxxxxx; ietf@xxxxxxxx
> >> Subject: Re: [mpls] unresolved technical concerns
> >>
> >> Yep. We are going in circles again.
> >> We need to see technical details on the issues documented in an I-D
> as
> >> Stewart suggested.
> >> Don't remember seeing such document either.
> >>
> >> Luyuan
> >>
> >>
> >> > -----Original Message-----
> >> > From: mpls-bounces@xxxxxxxx [mailto:mpls-bounces@xxxxxxxx] On
> Behalf
> >> Of
> >> > Alexander Vainshtein
> >> > Sent: Wednesday, October 05, 2011 4:18 PM
> >> > To: D'Alessandro Alessandro Gerardo; Stewart Bryant (stbryant)
> >> > Cc: ietf@xxxxxxxx; mpls@xxxxxxxx
> >> > Subject: Re: [mpls] unresolved technical concerns
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Dear Alessandro,
> >> > Lots  of thanks for a prompt response.
> >> >
> >> > Unfortunately your response does not really help (at least, me) to
> >> > identify even a single
> >> > specific technical issue. You may attribute it to my faulty
> memory,
> >> > but I could not remember any. Presenting these cocerns in the form
> >> > of an I-D as suggested by Stewart would  be the right first step.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > My 2c
> >> > Sasha
> >> >
> >> > ________________________________________
> >> > From: D'Alessandro Alessandro Gerardo
> >> > [alessandro.dalessandro@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
> >> > Sent: Wednesday, October 05, 2011 6:54 PM
> >> > To: stbryant@xxxxxxxxx; Alexander Vainshtein
> >> > Cc: adrian@xxxxxxxxxxxx; mpls@xxxxxxxx; ietf@xxxxxxxx
> >> > Subject: unresolved technical concerns
> >> >
> >> > Dear Stewart, Dear Sasha,
> >> > I think there are already enough contributions in that direction I
> >> > (with many other experts) contributed to in the form of IETF
> mailing
> >> > list discussion and ITU-T liaisons. Unfortunately I regret to say
> >> that
> >> > some questions for clarification and concerns risen in those
> emails
> >> > (for sure some of mine) still remain without an answer. At the
> same
> >> > time, some comments provided by ITU-T liaisons still remain
> >> unresolved.
> >> >
> >> > Best regards,
> >> > Alessandro
> >> >
> >> > ------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> > Telecom Italia
> >> > Alessandro D'Alessandro
> >> > Transport Innovation
> >> > Via Reiss Romoli, 274 - 10148 Torino
> >> > phone:  +39 011 228 5887
> >> > mobile: +39 335 766 9607
> >> > fax: +39 06 418 639 07
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > -----Messaggio originale-----
> >> > Da: Stewart Bryant [mailto:stbryant@xxxxxxxxx]
> >> > Inviato: mercoledì 5 ottobre 2011 12:24
> >> > A: D'Alessandro Alessandro Gerardo
> >> > Cc: adrian@xxxxxxxxxxxx; mpls@xxxxxxxx; ietf@xxxxxxxx
> >> > Oggetto: Re: [mpls] R: FW: Last Call: <draft-sprecher-mpls-tp-oam-
> >> > considerations-01.txt> (The Reasons for Selecting a Single
> Solution
> >> for
> >> > MPLS-TP OAM) to Informational RFC
> >> >
> >> > On 05/10/2011 10:38, D'Alessandro Alessandro Gerardo wrote:
> >> >  > major unresolved technical concerns
> >> >
> >> > Alessandro
> >> >
> >> > Please can I suggest that you write an internet draft detailing
> these
> >> > "major unresolved technical concerns" so that we can all
> understand
> >> > them.
> >> >
> >> > Such a draft needs to be technical, and describe the actions that
> the
> >> > network operator is unable to perform, or the fault cases that
> they
> >> are
> >> > unable to diagnose using the OAM defined in the IETF RFCs, or late
> >> > stage WG drafts.
> >> >
> >> > Alternatively if you are referring to a bug in the MPLS-TP OAM
> >> > protocols, you need to tell the community what it is.
> >> >
> >> > I believe that this request has been made  a number of times, in
> >> > various forums, and, as far as I know, no document has yet been
> >> > produced.
> >> >
> >> > An argument of the form "you must standardize what I want"
> >> > will not fly. What is needed is a very clear technical definition
> of
> >> > the issue(s).
> >> >
> >> > When we have the "major unresolved technical concerns"
> >> > on the table, we will be in a position to determine the best
> >> > disposition of those issues.
> >> >
> >> > Stewart
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > --
> >> > For corporate legal information go to:
> >> >
> >> > http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
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> >> alle
> >> > persone indicate. La diffusione, copia o qualsiasi altra azione
> >> > derivante dalla conoscenza di queste informazioni sono
> rigorosamente
> >> > vietate. Qualora abbiate ricevuto questo documento per errore
> siete
> >> > cortesemente pregati di darne immediata comunicazione al mittente
> e
> >> di
> >> > provvedere alla sua distruzione, Grazie.
> >> >
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> >> > _______________________________________________
> >> > mpls mailing list
> >> > mpls@xxxxxxxx
> >> > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mpls
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> mpls mailing list
> >> mpls@xxxxxxxx
> >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mpls
> >_______________________________________________
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> >https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mpls
> >
> 

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