Ted Hardie wrote: ... > Perhaps it is just me; this is not stuff I am following in any depth. > But the > impression I'm getting from following the thread is that there is some > disagreement about how to structure the work to make sure it really > does reduce pain, rather than just shift it around. It is not just you. The basic tenant here is a hand-wave that some magic set of engineering choices will resolve a collection of policy conflicts. Fortunately there is enough sanity to recognize that we don't even have a consistent view of the problem space, so the intent as I understand it is to document what we know. That step is not going to either reduce pain or move it, but the follow-on will result in moving it because the network admin's perspective of what is 'right' is in direct conflict with the perspective of the sys admin, and neither of them care about the end user trying to get something done. Resolving this requires a real signaling and negotiation infrastructure, and the IETF has refused to replace RSVP as an endpoint signaling path, so the entire effort can only lead to shifting the pain. Tony _______________________________________________ Ietf@xxxxxxxx https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf