On Wed, 19 Nov 2008, Dave CROCKER wrote: > It's not a matter of being dragged into politics. (Or at least, it shouldn't be.) > > It's essentially an engineering task of working to maximize the ability of > people to attend IETF meetings, by looking for venues where visa processing is > the least problematic. > > That does not mean "no visas" or anything else simplistic, except that border > controls do not impose undue and unpredictable barriers. That is a one dimensional view of a multiple dimensional problem. The object should be to maximize the ability of people to attend IETF meetings. Ignoring the point made that contextual issues often change between when a meeting is scheduled and when it actually happens, predictable visa process has to share the stage with travel costs, perception of personal safety, etc. Finding a venue with no visa issues may also be a venue where average travel cost is doubled or more. I submit that is not a solution. Finding a venue with no visa issues and no local sponsor is not optimal. Etc. I think it will be much more productive to focus on how to minimize the visa process instability associated with travel to an already selected venue then to try and select a venue whose current visa rules are very tolerant. Having seen this subject many times over the past few years, it is clear to me that starting the process early to obtain a clear set of procedures from the venue country and making sure all of the steps are known and in place well in advance is the best way to mitigate the problem. I suspect that travel industry professionals know the 3sigma processing time for visa applications to other countries from their country. Use that expertise to plan timelines for encouraging attendees to start the process. Etc. David Morris _______________________________________________ Ietf@xxxxxxxx https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf