>>>>> "Hallam-Baker," == Hallam-Baker, Phillip <pbaker@xxxxxxxxxxxx> writes: Hallam-Baker,> There is another problem to do with consensus and Hallam-Baker,> the status quo. Say we have a situation where a Hallam-Baker,> clear majority of a working group believes that a Hallam-Baker,> spec is unworkable unless a particular change is Hallam-Baker,> made. A small minority opposes the change for Hallam-Baker,> ideological reasons. Hallam-Baker,> Should the outcome in this case be: Hallam-Baker,> 1) Neither proposal can advance until there is Hallam-Baker,> consensus Steve answered part of this. If the minority is large enough--and I think that reasonably small is large enough--then I think 1) is the right outcome. Often you can get consensus on a way to break the deadlock even if you can't get consensus on the issue directly. There are a lot of things you as a chair can do to try and break these deadlocks. Ultimately, though, if you can't get consensus you can't get consensus. I realize we disagree on this point, but ideology is a fine reason in my mind to fail to have consensus. _______________________________________________ Ietf@xxxxxxxx https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf