> Why is this true - I am not saying its not but its an assertion that is undocumented and unsupported. Well, we could do a process experiment. No standards-track RFCs for 5 years, and the start afresh. Not sure I would support experiment, but I can't think of any other way to prove the tenets. Actually, even that experiment wouldn't be proof without a control group. So perhaps we should try 5 years of RFCs only for the western hemisphere and see if the eastern hemisphere has faith in the RFC series 5 years later. > So how does this work - why would the series be less valuable and because of what - In psychophysics there is the concept of the Just Noticeable Difference or JND. The JND is the minimal change in the physical world that produces a noticeable effect on the senses. JNDs are the main experimental method for studying the so called mind-body connection problem. Imagine sitting in the desert before sunrise. At first everything is dark, and then you perceive a small amount of light. That is the first unit. Then after a while you can say that you have seen an increase in the amount of light. Two units. In that way you continue until full sunlight (N units). It turns out that the JND units are logarithmically related to the amount of light as measured by a photometer; i.e. when it was still relatively dark we notice very small changes, but once the sun is half up tremendous increases can go by un-noticed. Now imagine sitting watching Internet technology develop. At the beginning every addition was immediately noticeable. IP, TCP, ICMP, etc each were a JND. Over time individual RFCs that may make giant contributions and require much more sophistication are no longer considered major steps, perhaps only the entire output of a WG, dozens of RFCs, maps into a single JND. (This does not denigrate high number RFCs as compared to low number ones, it is just a feature of the body-mind mapping.) However, each JND is conceived as one more step in a path to enlightenment. Now consider what woud happen were we to cover the person sitting in the desert with a black cloth after 1/2 hour of observing the minute changes, and then uncover him. He would immediately note a giant change in the amount of light. He would certainly not be able to quantify the change or on its basis tell how much time had elapsed, and may even not be sure that he was still in the same place. Loss of physchological continuity would cause Internet standards observers to lose faith in the new work being done, which would no longer be considered a direct consequence of continuous development efforts. New work would seem unnecessary and overly complex, the jump would simply be too many JNDs for the mind to grasp. > this is a key question in establishing a value propisition for the IETF's wares. Agreed. Y(J)S _______________________________________________ Ietf@xxxxxxxx https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf