On Wed, 16 Feb 2005 11:57:47 -0800, Fred Baker wrote: >Yes. Kudos to both of them. Another datapoint, from Yesterday's Spam-L: ---------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 18:11:45 +0000 From: Steve Linford <linford@xxxxxxxxxxxx> Subject: Re: MEDIA, LEGAL: (Send-safe) - Spammers outwit blacklist strategy On 15 Feb 2005, at 17:10, /dev/rob0 wrote: > It looks criminal to me. > > And yet ... send-safe.com is still online ... paypal.com is accepting > payments for them ... nothing is done. (No, I'm not surprised.) > > Sure, the send-safe bastard is safe in Russia, but both MCI and Paypal > are operating in the USA. MCI, right up to Vint Cerf, are insisting that Send Safe is just ordinary software with no illegal features, and that it "could" be used for spamming only in the way a crowbar could be used for breaking and entering, or an innocent tobacco pipe could used for smoking dope. Our reply to these analogies is that if you sell pipes specifically designed for use with marijuana, with features only for marijuana use, and the pipe is designed to contact the pusher and download the marijuana into it's bowl, and designed to hijack innocent people (proxies) to pass the marijuana smoke through before inhaling to implicate them, while anonymising the smoker from the police by rotating the smoker's name, and even comes packaged with lists of innocent people pre-infected to be used for this purpose, you can bet you're going to jail. I reminded Vint Cerf of his "spam is bad for the net" quote displayed on the CAUCE site, and asked for his help in getting the MCI spamware issue solved. He said he'd look into it, but got back to me saying the 1st Amendment made MCI not terminate spamware vendors no matter how illegal... so I gave him a link to the LINX BCP document and quoted the LINX text to him, he replied that the LINX BCP document was "probably illegal" in the USA (and hence MCI was ignoring it). Basically, MCI is trying every excuse under the sun to keep Send Safe and the many spam gangs they're servicing. MCI says Send Safe is not the MCI customer, their customer 'MTI' is an "ISP" who is in turn reselling to Send Safe and it's therefore out of their control. They know perfectly well (and are lying to the press that they don't) that ROKSO-listed MTI is Rusty Campbell's (DesktopServer) spamware outfit, not an ISP by any stretch of imagination, and that ISPs don't normally have only 6 IPs, and that the Send Safe website is directly on the end of the MCI line, one IP away from Rusty's router. John St. Clair and the rest of the 'abuse' droids at MCI have known perfectly well for over a year that MTI's sole business is spamming and that the sole things hosted on Rusty Campbell's web server at 65.210.168.34 are 25 web sites, which are: 1 0-BULKEMAIL.COM. 2 ADOGWITHOUTWARNING.COM. 3 AMAZING-BULK-EMAIL.COM. 4 AMAZINGBULKEMAIL.COM. 5 BULK-EMAIL-WORLDWIDE.COM. 6 BULKEMAILREVIEW.COM. 7 BULKEMAILREVIEWS.COM. 8 DESKTOP-SERVER.COM. 9 DESKTOPSERVER.BIZ. 10 DESKTOPSERVER.COM. 11 DESKTOPSERVERPRO.COM. 12 DESKTOPSERVERSALES.COM. 13 DESKTOPSERVERSHOP.COM. 14 EASYBIZ.COM. 15 EMAILBROADCASTER.COM. 16 EMAILEMAILEMAIL.COM. 17 EMAILTOOLS.COM. 18 MONEYFUN.COM. 19 MTICD.COM. 20 MTIDEALER.COM. 21 MTIHELP.COM. 22 MTILAB.NET. 23 MTISOFTWARE.COM. 24 SEND-SAFE.COM. 25 THEINTERNETBIZ.COM. MCI says these are all normal customers of the "ISP" Rusty Campbell who just happens to be the author of DesktopServer and to MCI it's all good paying business and nobody's going to stop them, least of all those darn anti-spammers. Amazingly, in 2003 we had kicked Send-safe.com off 4 Chinese "bullet-proof hosts" before they found safe haven at MCI in the US. MCI makes even the worst Chinese network look clean. Steve Linford The Spamhaus Project http://www.spamhaus.org -- Internal Virus Database is out-of-date. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.8.7 - Release Date: 2/10/2005 _______________________________________________ Ietf@xxxxxxxx https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf