Rather than losing these reasonable thoughts, I stuck them in the
transition team Wiki under "IAOC Instructions". They will be remembered.
Thanks, Sam!
--On 27. januar 2005 22:44 -0500 Sam Hartman <hartmans-ietf@xxxxxxx> wrote:
I think we are very close here. I can live with Margaret's text with
Leslie's proposed changes. It's actually very close to something I
would be happy with.
I've been rethinking my position since yesterday. I realized that
most of what I want does not require formalism or requires very little
formalism. In particular, I'm happy to live with a system in which
decisions are not overturned except by the IAOC (although I like In
addition, I think requiring requests for appeal/review to be acted on
when they are simply arguing that decision is bad instead of that
decisions did not follow written procedures/rules would be open to
abuse.
Here is what I want in addition to Margaret's formulation. I want to
see if I can get agreement on these (I suspect the answer will be yes)
before working on text. IT may turn out that the BCP is the wrong
place for such text.
* The IAOC can choose to overturn or otherwise act to reverse a
decision if it believes that is the best course of action to follow.
Examples include changing procedures if they happen not to work very
well or attempting to buy out or terminate a contract if it is clear
that the contract is no longer in the IASA's best interest.
* Members of the IAOC may take into account comments from the
community and may decide to reconsider a decision based on such
comments even if no formal requirement to review the decision or to
respond to the comments exists. In other words if the community
convinces the IAOC they were wrong, it is reasonable for the IAOC to
go do something about it.
* The IAOC should listen to comments. By this I mean that they should
be aware of comments they are receiving and weight them according to
their value. It's fine to ignore pointless comments; probably even
fine to pay less attention to comments from people who have a
track record of not providing useful input. It would not be
desirable for the IAOC to have completely ignored a constructive,
well-reasoned comment simply because there was no formal obligation
to respond to the comment. (The IAOC still might not respond, but
someone should have at least read the comment and considered what it
said)
* It is reasonable for individuals, groups or organized bodies to
comment to the community and the IAOC on IAOC decisions. For
example if the IAOC selected a meeting sight according to its
criteria and the IESG noticed that many working group chairs and
document authors were unwilling to come to this sight, it would be
reasonable for the IESG to inform the IAOC of this observation.
Depending on costs of canceling a meeting, it might (although
probably would not) be reasonable for the IESG to ask the IAOC to
reconsider.
When I phrase things this way instead of in thinking about them in the
context of formal appeals and reviews, they become stunningly obvious
at least for me. If these things are not true, I don't think we are
living up to an open transparent process receptive to the needs of the
IETF community. On the other hand, these things are sufficiently
obvious that perhaps nothing needs to be said about them. There is
one area where text might be useful.
I'd feel more comfortable if we added text encouraging members of the
community with comments about decisions to make those comments to the
community at large and/or the IAOC even if their comments did not meet
the criteria for formal review/appeal.
Sorry to run such a long chase and end up back mostly at nothing.
--Sam
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