Brian, Unfortunately I couldn't make the meeting this time, because of the change of date to November, so I don't have the full background to the discussion. On the subject of "mechanistic rules", however, I do feel happier that the pilot of my plane mechanically ( methodically ) checks through a list before taking off. You're right that methodology can't ensure quality - but it can help ensure that somebody is checking the quality. Regards, Graham Travers International Standards Manager BTexact Technologies e-mail: graham.travers@bt.com tel: +44(0) 1359 235086 mobile: +44(0) 7808 502536 fax: +44(0) 1359 235087 HWB279, PO Box 200,London, N18 1ZF, UK BTexact Technologies is a trademark of British Telecommunications plc Registered office: 81 Newgate Street London EC1A 7AJ Registered in England no. 1800000 This electronic message contains information from British Telecommunications plc which may be privileged or confidential. The information is intended to be for the use of the individual(s) or entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient be aware that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this information is prohibited. If you have received this electronic message in error, please notify us by telephone or email (to the numbers or address above) immediately. -----Original Message----- From: Brian E Carpenter [mailto:brian@hursley.ibm.com] Sent: 22 November 2002 13:35 To: Dave Crocker Cc: Charlie Perkins; iab@iab.org; ietf@ietf.org Subject: Re: Restatement of my proposal from last night's plenary Dave Crocker wrote: ... > If folks > have not yet read draft-huston-ietf-pact-00, they should read it now. If you think that mechanistic rules will improve quality, then yes, do read it. A remark I wanted to make last night is that a fair number of the phenomena that people don't like (such as noticing a problem late) are pretty much inevitable and in the "deal with it" class. Mechanistic rules won't help. A less complicated world would help, but that option isn't avaialable. I do strongly agree on the need for delegation, but that delegates responsibility and liability, not just the fun of reading 2000 pages of drafts. So it's easily said, but not easily done. Brian