*> *> The problem as I see it is that the Engineer (or child) in us is frightened *> by this, since traditionally the commercial folks (the adults) have driven Unbelieveable arrogance. You have the roles confused. Children say, "I know what I want, and I want it NOW! [And I don't care about the effect it has on anyone else, or on me in the future!]" Now, does that sound like an Engineer speaking? Sounds more like "commercial folks" to me. Bob Braden