This will probably be my only intervention on this topic. Le nonidi 29 frimaire, an CCXXV, Emmanuele Bassi a écrit : > I honestly could live without the contempt and entitlement that have > been expressed in this (and other) threads. Contempt is usually a symmetric thing. If users felt less contempt from some developers about their needs and preferences, maybe they would express their complaints and requests in a milder manner. > "gtk3-nocsd" is a massive hack that undoes what application developers > want to achieve in the first place. I will not contradict this. > It's entirely your prerogative to hack on your own copy of GTK+, but > that's simply a broken approach. GTK has nothing to do with > client-side decorations, outside of: > > * providing an API for using them from applications > * using them for the dialogue windows it creates — *if* the > configuration toggle for them is set "I did not kill anybody, I only designed and built the guns." This is, mutatis mutandis and with all proportions of severity scaled, exactly the same argument, and it amounts to nothing. I will assume that CSD were implemented in Gtk+ because application developers requested it; if it was an initiative from the Gtk+ developers, it is even worse. When CSD were requested, the Gtk+ developers should have taken a stand: "no, CSD are an awful UI design, we will not implement it in our library". They did just that when application developers requested window-in-window multi-document interface, and I supported them heartedly. Instead, they (you?) took a stand against users, not only by implementing it but also by making it impossible to disable it. > This is ridiculous. > > The people that "get to decide" are: > > * application developers > * toolkit developers Nice view on the whole Libre software thing. > Additionally, you're entitled by the license used to take the code and > do what you want with it. > > Those are the only two things you can "decide": whether to involve > yourself in the development upstream, or fork it and take matters in > your own hands. A fork is exactly what you will eventually get. You are very wrong to encourage it. I lived a fork from the inside six years ago, and it was awful, we are still not fully recovered. > GNOME developers are the reason GTK+ exists in the first place, Sorry, despite mostly lurking, I have been around longer than you, and you are wrong: Gtk+ exists because of Gimp, not Gnome. And the policy turned sour about the same time the Gnome developers overflowed the original Gimp developers. > Writing free software is not software development camp. You don't get > a prize just for showing up. Either you put your money where your > mouth is, or you don't get to say "you know better". You are funny. Regards, -- Nicolas George
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