HTML output is here: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/DocsProject/SteeringCommittee/Meetings/Minutes/IRCLog20070520 09:04 < quaid> <meeting> 09:05 < quaid> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/DocsProject/SteeringCommittee/Meetings#Agenda 09:06 < quaid> 07:42 < stickster> If I can connect from my buddy's house I will do so 09:06 < quaid> 07:45 < stickster> In case I don't make it, release-notes are currently building fine from CVS HEAD 09:06 < quaid> 07:45 < stickster> The IG is progressing, see f-docs-commits for detail 09:06 < quaid> 07:46 < stickster> Closd a number of bugs yesterday for IG 09:07 < quaid> so, at least those essential pieces are in the clear 09:07 < quaid> I still plan a good round of edits to the IG 09:07 < quaid> anyone should give it a go; you can use Yelp to display the XML in real-time for easy editing fun. 09:08 < JonRob> (still to get my teeth into cvs...maybe this is a good chance) 09:09 < quaid> yeh, it's pretty easy 09:10 < couf> ah yeah, saw that some time ago, any link? 09:11 < quaid> sorry, CVS usage? 09:11 < couf> quaid: yelp :-) 09:11 < quaid> ah 09:11 < couf> my bad 09:11 < quaid> hmm, you know ... we haven't a write up 09:11 < quaid> maybe under DP/Tools ? 09:11 < JonRob> it's in the archives...the bit about yelp 09:12 < quaid> anyway, you just do 'yelp /path/to/RELEASE-NOTES.xml 09:12 < quaid> anyway, you just do 'yelp /path/to/RELEASE-NOTES.xml &' 09:12 < quaid> it will build up the whole document that is called by that parent XML file, and display it 09:12 < couf> ah right, thanks 09:13 < quaid> then when you edit, you just reload (I close and reopen, since there isn't a reload function I've seen) 09:13 < quaid> so, about the guides ... 09:13 < JonRob> https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-docs-list/2007-April/msg00199.html 09:13 * jmbuser will document this soon - very slick 09:13 < JonRob> is the message 09:13 < quaid> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/DocsProject/Schedule#guides-schedule 09:13 < couf> thanks JonRob 09:14 < quaid> ok, now that schedule is for anything that we want to get translated in time for release 09:14 < quaid> last week we decided that the relnotes and IG are the two "must haves" for release 09:15 < quaid> so, yes, anything the group can do to help make sure that the IG goes to trans on time is a Good Thing. 09:15 < quaid> as for the other guides ... 09:15 < quaid> we have strong leadership from jmbuser for the UG, but ... 09:16 < quaid> jmbuser: do you have an identified team helping? or is it a loose group? do you want it formalized more? 09:16 < jmbuser> quaid: No identifiable group so far...correct me if I'm wrong 09:17 < quaid> hmm 09:17 < JonRob> i'll jump in if you need it 09:17 < JonRob> will have a lot more time this week 09:17 < quaid> well, yes the folks on the http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs/Drafts/DesktopUserGuide/Contributors page ... aren't that evident currently 09:17 < jmbuser> quaid: I'm willing to solo, but I would prefer an ensemble effort 09:17 < jmbuser> JonRob: Thanks 09:17 < quaid> JonRob: consider yourself engaged with this then :) 09:18 < quaid> add yourself to the Contributors page 09:18 < JonRob> quaid: sure 09:18 < JonRob> jmbuser: no problem :D 09:18 < jmbuser> I need to put the framework in place - and then please fill in where you can 09:18 < jmbuser> quaid: +1 09:18 < couf> jmbuser's grand idea for the FUG :-) 09:18 < quaid> jmbuser: one tip, feel free to brain-dump into the wiki, just put a comment in the commit note about the state of the content 09:19 < quaid> that helps editors know "ignore, edit, or make pariah from" :) 09:19 < jmbuser> quaid: NP - I noticed an "es" translation of the docs/drafts version today - very scary 09:19 < quaid> in the wiki? eek 09:19 < couf> yeah, should we talk to that guy? 09:19 < quaid> definitely shouldn't be translating in the Wiki 09:19 < jmbuser> quaid: I was thinking of a warning label 09:20 < quaid> yes 09:20 < couf> he's been keeping up with your work for most of it 09:20 < quaid> at this point, we are moving clearly to Plone, although the schedule is a bit unknown when what will be where 09:20 -!- [splinux] [n=[splinux@fedora/splinux] has joined #fedora-docs 09:21 < quaid> hey, there's one of the folks who has written for the UG 09:21 < jmbuser> I deinitely need to put something like a "blasting zone" danger sign up :-) 09:21 < couf> [splinux]: damien run ;-) 09:21 < jmbuser> s/deinitely/definitely/ 09:21 < quaid> [splinux]: we're on the final push for the Fedora User Guide for F7, if you are interested in helping with this release 09:21 < quaid> :) 09:22 < jmbuser> [splinux]: Welcome 09:23 < [splinux]> hey all 09:23 < couf> so first call is IG, anyone willing to spend some time, get into the FUG 09:23 -!- pingou_laptop [n=pingou@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] has joined #fedora-docs 09:23 < pingou_laptop> hi 09:23 < quaid> in fact, the IG is just a few days from going out for translation, so that is quite timely 09:23 < [splinux]> quaid, I'm busy for this week :( 09:24 < jmbuser> I will take responsibility for not hassling, er, following up with contributors 09:24 < quaid> [splinux]: no worries, just pouncing since you walked in the channel in a timely fashion :) 09:24 < [splinux]> :) 09:25 < jmbuser> IG is higher priority - we can do an F7 FUG announcement later, like for FC6 DUG 09:26 < quaid> yep 09:26 < quaid> ok, let's try another on-list reminder this week to help with the UG 09:27 < jmbuser> I plan to finish the outline, so that volunteers can pick a section and fill it out 09:27 < quaid> cool! 09:27 < jmbuser> I can also advertise it on my blog - after the outline's in place 09:27 < couf> yeah, get that out somewhere too 09:27 < JonRob> jmbuser: are you going to clean out a lot of the screenshots from later on in the guide? 09:27 < quaid> let's feature it a bit on the DP/Tasks page 09:27 < JonRob> i'll put it in fwn if appropriate 09:28 < quaid> not all the pieces, just a few pointers, maybe start a DP/Tasks/UserGuide for everythin 09:28 < jmbuser> JonRob: I plan to remove all screenshots except for the three desktops and I will leave in icons 09:28 < couf> quaid: +1 09:29 < JonRob> jmbuser: cool 09:29 < jmbuser> JonRob: This will speed things up and make it easier to translate 09:29 < JonRob> will look better too i think 09:29 < jmbuser> JonRob: agreed 09:30 < quaid> I haven't been able to do much extra at all, such as the Tasks page, we still need to jam it ahead as a collaboratively built page 09:32 < JonRob> quaid: if i find the time i'll help out here too 09:33 < quaid> ok, so for the rest of the guides ... 09:34 < couf> AG guide is something we should get started on post F7 09:35 < couf> and as fast as possible, to get this out somewhat half of the F8 cycle, as this doesn't change that much between releases 09:36 < quaid> we're having a bit of a lull in writing participation, is this just the time of year (school end) and near-to-release? 09:36 < quaid> maybe we should do the bulk of writing for these kind of guides between releases, and just have them updated lightly when the next release near? 09:36 < JonRob> quaid: sounds like a good approach, minimises stress! 09:36 < jmbuser> quaid: +1 09:36 < couf> quaid: yeah, a combination of both 09:36 < couf> quaid: +1 09:38 < JonRob> what do people think of the software management guide? 09:39 < JonRob> could a lot of that be pulled into the admin guide? 09:39 < JonRob> or maybe the essentials 09:39 < quaid> well 09:39 < quaid> it's for end-users 09:39 < pingou_laptop> I have to go ... 09:39 -!- pingou_laptop [n=pingou@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] has left #fedora-docs ["Salut!!"] 09:40 < quaid> JonRob: we wouldn't want to send end-users into a chapter of the AG to learn something, too scary 09:40 < quaid> the idea of the stand-alone is to empower those users, "oh, this is easy" 09:40 < couf> part in DUG, part in AG? 09:40 < JonRob> quaid: yeah but a lot of the SMG is pretty scary! 09:40 < couf> as in updating your software -> DUG, adding repo's -> AG 09:40 < quaid> hmm 09:40 < quaid> true that 09:41 < quaid> mether: you about? 09:41 < quaid> that's a sensible proposal, i think 09:41 < quaid> JonRob: can you make that suggestion (as couf laid it out) on-list? 09:42 < JonRob> quaid: sure 09:42 < quaid> mether has been doing the bulk of the work there, I'm sure he'll think it's a good idea, and the advantage of adding a little content to grow an existing team effort is a good one 09:43 < quaid> ok, then, let's cover the last item ... 09:44 < quaid> en v. en_US etc. 09:44 < quaid> now, I claim near-ignorance here, I've never researched the standards and UTF needs and such 09:45 < JonRob> (posted to the list, hope i got the message across) 09:47 < couf> hmm it seems the official list says it's a three character thing right now 09:47 < couf> http://www.loc.gov/standards/iso639-2/ISO-639-2_values_8bits-utf-8.txt 09:47 < couf> http://www.loc.gov/standards/iso639-2/php/code_list.php 09:47 < couf> last one is a bit easier to read 09:49 < quaid> so what is the deal with the _XY 09:49 < couf> it seemed to have never been an ISO-standard 09:49 -!- [splinux] [n=[splinux@fedora/splinux] has left #fedora-docs ["Quitte"] 09:51 < couf> so that would mean ... 09:52 < couf> a) everything has to a ab-type code 09:52 < couf> b) change like everything to the newest ISO standard, meaning docs, software, .... 09:52 < couf> and hope that gettext get's this 09:57 < couf> ah, got the _XY, it's the country code, which may be added to specify to which country this specific translation applies 09:59 < quaid> ah 09:59 < quaid> cool 10:00 < quaid> couf: we do specifically use US English in these cases 10:00 < quaid> why? 10:00 < quaid> I want a Brit to be able to write en_UK and then I can become a translator! 10:01 < couf> quaid: you're americans ;-) 10:01 < couf> as such, should we move everything on docs.fp.org to use en_US instead of en? 10:02 < quaid> probably 10:02 < quaid> in fact, that is a leftover inconsistency yes 10:03 < quaid> ok, let's confirm this detail to the list so there are no surprises 10:03 * quaid asks couf to send that email 10:03 < quaid> and then we can close this meetin' 10:03 < couf> sure 10:04 < quaid> rather ... any other business/topics? 10:04 < couf> ow yeah, I've got one left 10:04 < couf> are we gonna update the style to the new static page style, or stay like it is and wait for plone? 10:05 < JonRob> there's a new static page style!? 10:06 < couf> JonRob: yeah, it's coming http://fedora.riczho.dyndns.org/static/ 10:06 < quaid> oh, we can wait 10:06 < quaid> well, I see what you mean 10:06 < quaid> we could update docs.fp.o, sure 10:06 < quaid> ultimately, yes, Plone will handle it, and we'll port the CSS to the Wiki as well 10:06 < JonRob> couf: cool :D 10:07 < quaid> JonRob: static page because we want the front of fp.o to load fast for the release, unlike for FC-6 10:07 < quaid> so we're doing two-birds, one-stone -- static page and new style for the site 10:07 < JonRob> quaid: yeah, is awesome idea i think 10:07 < quaid> couf: let's plan on updating docs.fp.o with the new style, once it is fully baked 10:08 < quaid> it's actually in CVS now, so we could start experimenting 10:08 < couf> quaid: cool 10:08 * quaid is not sure if there are any here who like to play with CSS 10:08 < quaid> actually, I like it now, but I'm jammed on time, so I probably won't play 10:08 * couf thinks glezos ;-) 10:08 -!- jmbuser [n=jmbuser@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 10:08 < quaid> but it is all in cvs.fp.o:/cvs/web/static 10:09 -!- jmbuser [n=jmbuser@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] has joined #fedora-docs 10:09 < quaid> yeah, when glezos gets back from galavanting around, we'll ask him, if it's not done already :) 10:09 < couf> okay, well if I find some time, I'll have a got at it 10:10 < couf> that's all for me 10:10 < quaid> it's probably pretty straightforward 10:10 < quaid> esp with the Web Developer plugin for Firefox 10:10 < quaid> ok, if there is nothing more ... 10:10 * quaid waits 30 seconds 10:10 < couf> Web Devel + Firebug ++ :-) 10:11 < quaid> do they do similar things? or are they complementary? 10:11 < quaid> final countdown ... 10:11 < quaid> 5 10:11 < quaid> 4 10:11 < quaid> 3 10:11 < quaid> 2 10:11 < quaid> 1 10:11 < quaid> </meeting>
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