On Sat, Mar 8, 2025, at 6:27 AM, Neal Gompa wrote: > On Fri, Mar 7, 2025 at 12:57 PM Brendan Conoboy <blc@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote: >> >> With all this in mind, the big question is: When and how is it the right time to officially bring up Konflux in the Fedora community context? If it happens too early, it won’t look credible or be useful. If it happens too late, there won’t be an opportunity for interested community members to meaningfully shape its development. So far, Red Hat’s development team has erred on the side of too-early, with presentations in 2024 at Flock and Devconf. Community feedback is valuable and showing up too late to accept it would be a loss. >> >> Beyond presentations at conferences, the development team has created a Konflux + Fedora SIG, its own community mailing list, and even a matrix chat channel. The astute observer may note that some of the above URLs contain a combination of github.com and fedoraproject.org addresses. Similar to gcc using gnu.org and gnome using gnome.org, Konflux is meant to grow into a proper open source upstream, that many downstreams use, so public presence is not in Fedora alone. >> >> As it matures, I expect Konflux to be part of the way we improve Fedora CI, to be part of what powers a more intuitive git-native workflow, and an easier onramp for people who don’t currently participate in Fedora to join in with less friction. These dreams may be a little way out, but they are worth pursuing as we bring Forgejo online and realize its potential. So, what are the next steps right now? Let’s talk about it. >> > > I think you are not asking the right question here. This feels like a > presupposition that Konflux is the right replacement for our existing > infrastructure. But in the time I've heard about Konflux and seen > stuff about it, it has bothered me that I haven't heard anyone ask > this question: "what do you as Fedora contributors need from our > buildsystem that Koji isn't doing now?" > > Konflux being a skin on Tekton and leveraging OpenShift isn't actually > a valuable thing for us as Fedora contributors. The "git-native" > workflow is not a real thing. Git is un-opinionated beyond "don't > store binaries in it". > > So I think the question first needs to be asked with the mind that > Fedora contributors have experience with our existing build system and > want to improve their workflows. > > If I'm answering that question for myself, I would say that the > biggest feature gap that we have from a modern build system like the > Open Build Service is that we as packagers have to do dependency > resolution for building groups of packages. Nobody *likes* manually > sequencing packages for Koji chainbuilds. Nobody likes having to work > through reverse dependencies and manually building them when a library > has been upgraded. These are serious grunt work things that a computer > should do for us. Before I started seriously contributing to openSUSE > 10 years ago, I had never conceived it was possible, and now I want > that for Fedora contributors. This is probably a relevant part of any evaluation - and presumably is already done, but: - how easy is it to bootstrap the different options (Konflux, Koji, OBS etc)? - how easy is it to run each locally for those who want to dogfood the process or participate in development? Best regards, -- _o) Michel Lind _( ) identities: https://keyoxide.org/5dce2e7e9c3b1cffd335c1d78b229d2f7ccc04f2 README: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Salimma#README -- _______________________________________________ devel mailing list -- devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To unsubscribe send an email to devel-leave@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Do not reply to spam, report it: https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue
