On 5/31/23 20:02, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote:
On Wed, May 31, 2023 at 07:38:38PM +0200, Jiri Vanek wrote:
Can you clarify this a bit? It sounds like some versions of the JDK in
Fedora will actually be built in EPEL. I feel that all Fedora packages
should actually built for Fedora, not RHEL.
Also, what exactly does "latest live EPEL" mean - how is 8 the latest?
I guess basically, can you further explain/clarify exactly which
versions of what OS which JDKs will be built on, and when those versions
will change.
Jdk is designed, to be severely forward comaptible from os where it was built.
So jdk8, 11 and 17 would be build in oldest live fedora, and repacked
everywhere. The idea is to build them on oldest viable system, as we
can guarantee they will run ok in newer Fedroas..
java-latest-openjdk however, is built also for epel8 and elep9. Thus
logically the oldest system where we can built it to repack it everywhere
is el8. Then it can be reapcked for el8,el9, and all live fedoras.
IIRC, RHEL-8 forked from Fedora in circa F28 timeframe. Directly
comparing RHEL-8 content to Fedora is a bit of a fools errand since
RHEL does rebase certain packages periodically, but a decent chunk
of RHEL-8 is 5 years old at this point. The most notable part is
the compiler toolchain on RHEL-8 is GCC 8.x, which is 5 major
releases behind what F39 rawhide uses, and 4 major release behind
what F37 uses.
RHEL-8 also has a long lifetime left, and thus so does EPEL8. By
building JDK on EPEL8, we're fixing the toolchain for JDK in Fedora
on a version already 5 years out of date, and by the time EPEL8 goes
away, the toolchain will be 10+ years out of date.
By building JDK on the oldest stable Fedora release, we're fixing the
toolchain on a version that's never going to be much more then 1 year
out of date.
Same applies to compiler toolchain flags, though where the flags don't
depend on GCC version that can be partially mitigated in the JDK spec.
Overall, I find the idea of basing Fedora builds on oldest EPEL quite
challenging to accept, due to the age differences. It feels contrary
to Fedora goal of always being on, or at least very near, the cutting
edge.
I do not have hard requirement to build java-latest-openjdk on epel8 and
repack everywhere, but it gave sense. If the hard demand will be to build
also java-latest-opnejdk in oldest fedora, and repack in all fedoras, and
built it in oldest epel, and repack in all epels, then it gave somehow
sesnse too. Although I would conisdered it a bit wasted cycle, it is
acceptable.
IMHO it'd be more palatable for the RHEL (EPEL) build stream to be separate
from the Fedora build stream. While RHEL and Fedora share heritage, they are
ultimately different distros with different goals and needs.
Thanx for an input!
One important clarification whcih I will somehow try to include to proposal.
The epel thing is valid only for java-latest-openjdk, which is STS. It is much more likley, thet future jdk will not be buildable on epel8, and thus we wills top building it there as we did with epel7. Then we wll shift the build root to
the epel9 and so on.
Yet again thanx for input.
J.
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