Dan, I was reading your text and looks to me that you have not seen my proposal or you have decided to discard it totally. I did not find any of my ideas from your text. Either way, I copy/pasted my proposal here for your benefit and my proposal to SCOPE will be along these lines: --- Glenn et.al We at Nokia Siemens Networks have a firm opinion that these kind of RFPs should come from SCOPE Alliance (note, this is Nokia Siemens Networks opinion, not SCOPE at least yet). What we also think is that collectively we should start concentrating on working towards consistent Carrier Grade API set within Carrier Grade OS domain, like CG Linux. In order to do that, the following model is proposed: * LF-CGL would be primarily become implementors group with Carrier Grade focus. SCOPE Alliance develops gap / requirement document and spells out the need for APIs related to the gaps / requirements. This will given to LF-CGL, which then starts developing the APIs themselves. The development process should be full consensus based. When the APIs are defined, LF CGL includes the new APIs into LSB CGL module and they would then be automatically included into LSB certification process. In addition to this SCOPE would continue to profile existing API specs and then provides the profile (priorities) to LF-CGL group, which then works on those and makes sure they will be included into LSB CGL module. They would then be included into LSB certification process. ---- Cheers TimoJ -----Original Message----- From: lf_carrier-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:lf_carrier-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of ext Dan Kohn Sent: 29 August, 2007 21:02 To: lf_carrier@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: Draft CGL Re-charter [* Note: My apologies that this has taken so long to publish. I have tried to incorporate ideas from the list, but this is fundamentally a draft and comments are strongly requested. This charter is modeled on IETF working group charters such as <http://www.ietf.org/html.charters/atompub-charter.html>. We need volunteers for the chair and document editor roles. Also, please check out the placeholder Carrier Gaps page I created based on PAA <http://www.linux-foundation.org/en/Carrier_Gaps>. - dan *] DRAFT Carrier Grade Linux Re-Charter Chair(s): TBD Document Editors: TBD Linux Foundation (LF) Liason: Dan Kohn Workgroup pages: http://www.linux-foundation.org/en/Carrier_Grade_Linux http://www.linux-foundation.org/en/Carrier_Gaps Mailing list: lf_carrier@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx https://lists.linux-foundation.org/mailman/listinfo/lf_carrier Description of Workgroup This document lays out the new charter for the Carrier Grade Linux (CGL) workgroup. The workgroup's goal is to help improve Linux to better meet the needs of the telecommunications industry. The Linux community (also known as "upstream") works via collaborative, open development. For the kernel, that work is debated on the Linux Kernel Mailing List (LKML) and documented in the git source control system. A new kernel is released every 2 to 3 months, with consumer distros released every ~6 months, and enterprise distros every ~18 months. By contrast, the telecoms industry generally functions via Requests for Proposal (RFPs) and requirements documents. Carrier systems can be installed (and require support) for 5 or even 10 years. This workgroup aims to help the Linux and carrier communities better communicate their requirements and capabilities so that Linux can better satisfy carriers' needs. The workgroup will begin by taking the published CGL 4.0 documents and splitting them into two parts. The "Satisfied Requirements" document will include all requirements that are fully satisfied by the current mainline kernel and/or latest enterprise distributions. The goal is to have a formal way for the carrier community to communicate to their vendors and the Linux community what requirements they expect to continue to be satisfied over time. This document is not expected to change frequently, except by having new requirements added to it as they are satisfied. The second, and more dynamic document, is the "Carrier Gaps" document. This document describes carrier requirements that are not currently satisfied by the mainline kernel and/or latest enterprise distros. Each requirement will include one or more specific examples of carrier needs that are not currently being satisfied. These requirements should include some proof-of-concept to avoid blue-sky requirements. Examples of proofs-of-concept are proposed patchsets, the existence in other OSes like Windows or Solaris, or existing products that use different approaches such as a hard RTOS. Each section of the document will specify a requirement (what) and the justifications (why), but not the implementation (how). Although proposing a patchset is perhaps the most efficient way of demonstrating a capability, the CGL workgroup does not expect to dictate what patchsets should be accepted. Instead, the goal is to have kernel developers review and comment on these requirements on the CGL mailing list. This initial round of review will hopefully reveal issues that need to be addressed for a patch to be accepted, or at least serve to illustrate the underlying requirement that carriers are aiming to solve. Ultimately, any proposed kernel patches must be posted on LKML and accepted by the relevant subsystem maintainer under the normal kernel development process. The goal of CGL is to increase the early communication between the carrier and Linux communities to increase the probability that functionality needed by carriers and their vendors will be quickly adopted. When the importance of a requirement is broadly agreed among the CGL workgroup but the proposed implementation is not acceptable or does not exist, the LF is open to sponsoring a contractor to develop or enhance a specific, focused patchset. Ultimately, that patchset will still need to be accepted on LKML, but the LF can facilitate the process when no one vendor is willing or able to do the work. The LF has a directed funding program to enable companies to support this kind of project, and can hire contractors without charging any overhead costs. The "Carrier Gaps" document is expected to initially (and perhaps always) exist as a wiki page that can be edited by any member of the workgroup, although supervised by a document editor. It's at <http:// www.linux-foundation.org/en/Carrier_Gaps>. The aim is to dramatically lower the cycle times between the carrier community requesting functionality and the kernel community commenting on the features and/or implementing them. Rather than waiting for a lengthy publishing process, the idea is to use the Carrier Gaps document as a living repository of the status of different projects and the interaction with the kernel community. As functionality is implemented, the section would be moved to the Satisfied Requirements document. Functionality that is likely never to be implemented can, after discussion, be listed in a special section at the bottom to explain the history of the request and the negative response from the kernel community. While interactions with the kernel community are the initial focus of the workgroup, this format is expected to extend to other upstream communities as well. Interactions with SCOPE The CGL workgroup is eager not to duplicate or conflict with the work of the SCOPE Alliance <http://www.scope-alliance.org/>. The LF is the standardization and certification authority for Linux. SCOPE "is an industry alliance committed to accelerating the deployment of carrier grade base platforms for service provider applications". CGL documents can and generally will be issued as LF standards. SCOPE does not write standards itself, but publishes profiles of other organization's standards. The goal of CGL is to be an upstream standards group providing standards that SCOPE can recommend. This can most efficiently be accomplished by having SCOPE members participate directly in the CGL Workgroup, so that by the time the output gets to SCOPE, most potential conflicts will have been resolved. In particular, it is expected that the Satisfied Requirements document will be the best source for SCOPE to cite. SCOPE members participating in CGL will be assumed to be representing their own company's interests unless they explicitly state that they are speaking for SCOPE. That enables SCOPE members to engage in early participation while reserving official acceptance of a standard to the SCOPE board. LSB Modules The Linux Standard Base supports the implementation of optional modules specifying certain functionality. In most cases, that functionality would need to have an associated test suite. If the CGL workgroup decides it would be useful, construction of a CGL LSB module could enable a more rigorous certification process. However, any LSB work is initially out of scope of the workgroup, and will require an update of this charter to initiate. Governance The Governance of CGL will begin very lightweight. If contentious issues arise, we can move to a heavier-weight structure, such as that used by the LSB <http://www.linux-foundation.org/en/ LSB_Charter#Leadership_and_Governance>. The workgroup is led by one or more chairpersons, who are appointed by the LF Executive Director with the advice of the workgroup. The workgroup operates on an IETF-like "rough consensus" model. "Rough consensus" is determined by the chair. Decisions by the chair which contributors believe do not reflect rough consensus may be appealed first to the chair, then to the LF Executive Director, and finally to the LF board. Workgroup business is conducted in an open forum (typically a wiki, mailing lists, conference calls, and periodic face-to-face meetings). Membership in the workgroup is open. Decisions must be clearly documented in that open forum along with any outstanding issues, which may be used as the basis for further discussion. Certification/registration services may be restricted to LF members. Exceptions will generally be made for non-profit projects like Debian. The chair, with the advice of the workgroup, will appoint one or more document editors. The chair will work with the LF Liason to request and organize any LF resources to assist with the workgroup's activities. Adoption of this charter and future updates to it require rough consensus of the working group. Goals and Milestones September 2007 At least 10 requirements moved from CGL 4.0 document to Carrier Gaps October 2007 Satisfied Requirements draft October 2007 Initial reaction from kernel developers on at least 3 requirements November 2007 Re-evaluate new workgroup structure and set new milestones Published Documents CGL 4.0 Documents <http://www.linux-foundation.org/en/ Carrier_Grade_Linux> Carrier Gaps <http://www.linux-foundation.org/en/Carrier_Gaps> - dan -- Dan Kohn <mailto:dan@xxxxxxxxxxx> COO, The Linux Foundation <http://www.linux-foundation.org> <http://www.dankohn.com/> <tel:+1-415-233-1000> _______________________________________________ Lf_carrier mailing list Lf_carrier@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx https://lists.linux-foundation.org/mailman/listinfo/lf_carrier