David, You're an emotional writer but I'm on Baha's side in this one. As a well trained firearms instructor, the thought of most people carrying firearms scares me and "most people" includes pilots. If the pilot keeps the weapon in the aircraft I'll accept that reluctantly, but hopefully they'll be arrested immediately when carrying their weapons from the aircraft. You are simply incorrect if you believe the availability of guns is a factor in reducing crime. We have the highest violent crime rate in the industrialized world and hundreds of millions of firearms so you may deduce availability of firearms has the effect of contributing to the high crime rate. Because a few zealots citing Islamic beliefs attacked us doesn't mean Islam isn't a religion of peace any more than Christianity is a religion of peace after we killed 100,000 Iraqi, 4 million SE Asians, tens of thousands of Palestinians, 100,000 using weapons of mass destruction etc. More logic and common sense will go a lot further than murder.... Greg Newbold -----Original Message----- From: The Airline List [mailto:AIRLINE@LISTSERV.CUNY.EDU]On Behalf Of damiross2@attbi.com Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2002 1:49 PM To: AIRLINE@LISTSERV.CUNY.EDU Subject: Re: No guns for our airline pilots ...... Baha, What if the pax can't take care of the terrorists in the cabin? Not every aircraft has a reinforced, bullet proof door yet (believe the deadline is next year). What about smaller aircraft without a cockpit door (Cessnas, Pipers, etc.) There are still many aircraft flying that don't even require a flight attendant (any aircraft of 19 seats or less). BTW: There are studies that prove that when gun ownership goes up, crime goes down. Look at Australia - the government made it hard to possess weapons and the crime rate went up. As an aside, my personal opinion is that we stop pussyfooting around with Iraq, Iran, etc., tell them that the next time one of their countrymen do a terrorist act against us, they will be bombed out of existance - no ifs, ands, or buts! Islam - a religion of peace my ass! David Ross > Easy Joe, > US is not the only country that has been hit by terrorism and you know that. > Let's keep the subject confined to the guns in the cockpit. > Unfortunately, who ever came up with this, is thinking retroactively. > Look at the incidence with El AL flying to Istanbul and how the terrorist > was subdued by the pax and the security guard. > > Look at the ShoeBomber case, and see how pax and the F/As pulled together > and subdued him. I 'm all in favor of the fortified cockpit doors as that > will isolate the flight crew at the cockpit, help them to concentrate on > what they are supposed to do : fly the airplane. > > The pax will take care if any other kind of perpetrator in the cabin, > believe me. > > And the saddest part is terrorists are out smarting us once again. They > knew they couldn't get in the Arkia flight out of Kenya, and they used the > shoulder fired missiles. Do you think that the guns in the cockpit used > by pilots would help? > > I just don't see the reason why we should arm ourselves to the teeth when > we're the ONLY Western nation in the World that is already armed like > the cowboys in western movies.. > > BAHA ACUNER - CFI,CFII,MEI > Fan of spaghetti westerns > www.bahadiracuner.com > > -----Original Message----- > From: The Airline List [mailto:AIRLINE@LISTSERV.CUNY.EDU]On Behalf Of > www.joepries.com > Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2002 1:07 PM > To: AIRLINE@LISTSERV.CUNY.EDU > Subject: Re: No guns for our airline pilots ...... > > > David, > Lets try this- we'll have some terrorists hijack 2 BA 767s and 2 757s, crash > 2 of the 767s into downtown London, have a 757 crash in a field on the > countryside and another one crash into buckingham palace. Then we'll see > about being unpopular pal. BRING ON THE FIREPOWER. The only way to deal > with terrorists on commercial airliners is one- kill them where they stand. > G-d Bless America and our rights to protect ourselves > Joe > > > "David J. Wallace" <> wrote: > > Can't think why the US is so unpopular around the world when people spout > phrases like 'bring on the firepower' as freely as some do. > > ----- > > > Joe Pries Commercial Aviation Photography > Serving the airline industry with quality photography > AOL IM AIRLINE72 > http://www.joepries.com > > > --------------------------------- > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now