Asgeir Frimannsson wrote:
Overwhelming the user is my main concern, yes. Using the extra 200 px for an
application-based menu/toolbox/help-view, rather than cramming it in the
remaining 80%, would be much more favorable than 'wasting' it on a sub-optimal
global navigation.
You know, this all sounds well and good, but means absolutely nothing
without user feedback and testing of the specific designs we are
discussing. Of which we have nothing to back either of our claims as
mentioned earlier.
You wouldn't worry more about having 8 tabs horizontally across the top,
their German translations making the last two or three tabs scroll
horizotnally or jump down the next row? I don't think i18n is really a
good justification for your stance here.
That depends on how dominant this menu is on the page. To me, a global
navigation on a site like fpo should be clearly visible, but also easily
'ignorable' when working within a specific application. For example, google.com
has 12 Items in its' global menu (7 navigation, 5 other) when logged in, and
is localised in many languages, including German (which naturally takes more
space).
The Google.com bar you mention is for global naviation between separate
Google.com applications, not for navigation within a single application.
Remember that this navigation bar is not meant for global navigation
between sites or even between separate applications, as I said before it
is for navigation within a single application. I know quite well the
arguments against global navigation and I also do not think they apply
here as this is not a global navigation bar. To navigation between
various Fedora applications and sites it's been proposed to have a
customizable, very small bar (~40px tall) at the top or even bottom of
the screen to point to other applications very much in the style of the
Google.com bar you mentioned.
If the target is a site where the global navigation is a dominant element of
the page, then yes, I see your point, and having these tabs horizontally
wouldn't be feasible. But if the target is a Fedora themed 'frame' for
applications to inherit, with a non-intrusive global navigation, then I think
the proposal is a bit off target, and a smaller horizontal global navigation
would be a better option. That's my 2 cents.
I think you've made an incorrect assumption about how the navigation bar
is meant to be used. It's not global navigation, as I mentioned earlier
in the thread it's for various areas within a single application. There
is no global naviation in the mockups I've posted.
Re your 2 cents, you seem extremely interested in this. Would you mind
making some mockups and designs as alternative proposals? I think that
might be a lot more helpful than a long mailing list thread. I've spent
the past month or so making mine. Can you invest that kind of time into
this project? Because we are always looking for new websites team
contributors. Our meetings are every Monday evening Eastern time,
depending on the week 4 pm ET (next week) or 6 PM et (week after... it
alternates)
I am happy that we are having discussions about the design on the list
but at the same time I have seen time and time again discussions like
this to put a destructive stop to a project making forward progress, and
I would prefer to see this project get to the first major milestone and
improve it from that point based on actual user feedback rather than
just talk about design decisions that were made two months ago because I
think that's a better way to make sure that this project doesn't get
abandoned.
~m
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