15:42 < spevack> meeting in about 15 mins? 15:42 < spevack> anyone around? 15:43 < ivazquez> I am. 15:43 < ivazquez> For once :P 15:43 < spevack> how are you? 15:43 < ivazquez> Fine, yourself? 15:43 < spevack> doing well. I like these meetings because they are only at 10 PM and not midnight :) 15:43 < ivazquez> Heh. 15:45 -!- TimBurke [i=Tim@unaffiliated/timburke] has joined #fedora-websites 15:46 < spevack> is that *the* TimBurke?? 15:46 < TimBurke> Well I'm the one subscribed to the list, so maybe? 15:46 < spevack> Red Hat engineering manager Tim Burke? 15:46 < TimBurke> Ha. no. 15:47 < spevack> well, now you can be *the* Tim Burke, and he can be the *other* Tim Burke :) 15:47 < TimBurke> LOL ok. 15:47 < ianweller> oh, meeting in 13 or so. /me pays attention to things 15:49 < mmcgrath> spevack: I was laughing about that too 15:50 < spevack> mmcgrath: i was thinking wow, this meeting just went up a few notches in terms of importance :) 15:50 < spevack> either that or tim needs more to do! 15:53 < spevack> looks like the new planet look&feel just went live 15:54 < spevack> epiphany is not doing a very good job rendering it 15:55 -!- JonRob [n=jon@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] has joined #fedora-websites 15:56 < spevack> hi JonRob 15:56 < JonRob> hey spevack :) 15:57 < JonRob> u already for travelling to fudcon? 15:57 < spevack> my flight is at 9:30 or something like that tomorrow morning, UTC +2 15:57 < JonRob> ah not too bad then 15:58 < JonRob> picked my cousin up from the airport this morning - 7.55 arrival :S 15:58 < spevack> ugh 15:58 < JonRob> think she had to get out of bed at 3! 15:58 -!- fchiulli [i=824c4011@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-fbbe7db3111f0654] has joined #fedora-websites 15:59 < JonRob> thanks for doing the asterisk site btw... 15:59 < spevack> JonRob: no problem 16:00 < spevack> i sit here every week "leading" I figure it's time i actually did something! 16:00 < JonRob> lol 16:00 < ianweller> hehe 16:00 < spevack> ok, who's around? 16:00 < spevack> Roll call please 16:00 * ianweller 16:00 < spevack> Max Spevack 16:00 < JonRob> Jonathan Roberts 16:00 < ivazquez> Ignacio Vazquez-Abrams 16:01 < spevack> anyone else? 16:01 < fchiulli> Frank Chiulli 16:01 < spevack> how's everyone doing this week? 16:02 * stickster laughs at earlier TimBurke conversation 16:02 < giarc> CraigThomas 16:02 < giarc> we have a new planet! 16:02 < spevack> So i notice that the new look & feel is live 16:02 < spevack> giarc: that was my first topic :) 16:02 * ianweller applauds it 16:02 < spevack> I think it looks great 16:02 < spevack> but for the sake of completeness 16:02 < spevack> we need two more things 16:02 < giarc> ah i see that, reading the back scroll now... 16:02 < spevack> 1) a wiki page where people can file bugs 16:03 < spevack> 2) a blog post advertising that wiki page 16:03 < spevack> who wants this? 16:03 < JonRob> giarc: you rock :) 16:03 < abadger1999> Toshio Kuratomi 16:03 < spevack> yeah, great work craig 16:03 < giarc> ill make a wiki page 16:03 < giarc> thanks guys 16:03 < ianweller> speaking of bugs. http://planet.fedoraproject.org/heads/ -- that's still linked from the home page, but isn't being updated 16:04 < ianweller> so either it needs shot from the links list, or skvidal has more work cut out for him 16:04 < spevack> giarc: major congrats though. not picking on you -- *everything* needs a bugs page :) 16:04 < mmcgrath> we starting ze' meeting? 16:04 < spevack> we have 16:05 < JonRob> giarc - dare i ask, but do you have a new target for common look and feel? 16:05 < spevack> we're talking about the new look & feel of planet 16:05 < JonRob> lol sorry for asking! 16:05 < mmcgrath> ah 16:05 < giarc> spevack, i understand... 16:05 < giarc> docs 16:05 < giarc> unless we have other sites that we think need it more ? 16:05 < JonRob> giarc: cool - you shoud speak to couf as he was talking about moving the docs over to the websites' git repo 16:05 < ianweller> docs should be the next first priority, imho 16:06 * spevack votes with the majority 16:06 * couf checks in 16:06 < giarc> JonRob, ok, will do... 16:06 < giarc> and there he is! 16:06 < JonRob> speak of the devil :p 16:07 < giarc> couf, we are talking about common look and feel for docs.fp.o 16:07 * spevack takes a look at the current docs.fp/o 16:07 < couf> giarc: cool, my plan was to try and get the docbook stuff we get as docs to get embeded into the current website layout 16:07 < spevack> yeah, it def needs to be next 16:08 < spevack> fedora.redhat.com called from 2005 and wants its layout back :) 16:08 < giarc> heh 16:08 < couf> basiclly reuse the current build-script for the main site and change it for docbook stuff 16:09 < couf> that said, if you guys have a way better idea, please stop me :) 16:09 < spevack> giarc, stickster, quaid: any of you guys have something to add on this topic? 16:10 < spevack> so should we check in on this next week, then? 16:10 < couf> just to note: it has been mentioned in last FDSCo meeting, so they are on the same page 16:10 * spevack opens up the task list for editing 16:10 * giarc notes I wont be around next week 16:10 < spevack> well, next time you're around then. 16:11 < spevack> so giarc , while you are around, is there anything else on the general look & feel front that you'd like to discuss? 16:11 < JonRob> giarc: could you keep us updated on list? 16:11 * JonRob likes to know *everything* 16:11 < JonRob> *evil laugh* 16:11 -!- TimBurke [i=Tim@unaffiliated/timburke] has left #fedora-websites ["Leaving"] 16:11 < giarc> spevack, nothing now...but i will probably need to ping couf for help building/getting docs sources 16:12 < spevack> ok, good enough. 16:12 < giarc> JonRob, will do 16:12 < spevack> one last round of applause for giarc on the planet work! 16:12 * spevack claps 16:12 < JonRob> woop giarc :) 16:12 * ianweller applauds once more 16:12 * giarc blushes 16:12 * ianweller makes that annoying whistling noise that everyone does at concerts for some reason 16:12 < spevack> heh 16:12 < spevack> alrighty... 16:12 < spevack> let's see what else is on our task list 16:13 < spevack> so we have "common look and feel" 16:13 < spevack> which giarc is the owner of 16:13 < spevack> and "new look and feel" 16:13 < spevack> which jonrob is the owner of 16:13 < spevack> 'sup with that? 16:13 < JonRob> oo boy 16:13 < JonRob> ok - well 16:14 < JonRob> this was following on from mizmo's post to the list about "top 10 things for the website" 16:14 < JonRob> and we were moving along with the idea of usability testing the current website to see where we're going wrong compared to this current list 16:14 * ianweller mentions http://ianweller.org/2008/06/16/usability-testing-at-fudcon.html 16:15 < JonRob> before coming up with new design ideas for a "new look and feel" 16:15 < spevack> yes, i remember all of this 16:15 < spevack> so, are we doing some of that at fudcon? 16:15 < ianweller> i was planning to. 16:15 < spevack> excellent 16:15 < spevack> can you tell us what the general plan is? 16:15 < ianweller> spevack: i think you hinted at that maybe being a good session idea a few meetings ago ;) 16:16 < ianweller> well the general plan is to do some testing with random individuals at fudcon, after going over what we're testing with mizmo and others 16:16 < ianweller> and then reporting our findings at the barcamp session. 16:16 < ianweller> that's what i came up with after waking up today 16:16 < spevack> :) 16:16 < spevack> where will the testing take place? 16:16 < ianweller> haven't thought of that, was hoping you could help with that ;) 16:16 < spevack> well, ok then. 16:17 < spevack> so we need the person who is manning the Fedora Booth to know about it 16:17 < spevack> so that they can recruit volunteers 16:17 < ianweller> agreed 16:17 < spevack> i think we need to bribe folks who do it with some prize 16:17 < spevack> a sticker, a shirt, something 16:17 < spevack> do we have a task list, or exercise, or something people will try to do? 16:17 < ianweller> so you're thinking we should do it at the fedora booth? along with making usb keys and stuff 16:17 < spevack> no, just that the people at the fedora booth know about it 16:18 < ianweller> ok. 16:18 < spevack> but we do it in one of the corners of the hackfest 16:18 < spevack> where there is more space 16:18 < JonRob> spevack: i think...hold on, let me search the archives 'cos i created a wiki page somewhere but can't remember where! 16:18 < spevack> JonRob: the wiki elves recycled it :) 16:18 < ianweller> the mailing list post is where i'm starting from, but i'm gonna come up with a more organized task list later today and tomorrow 16:18 < ianweller> lolwut? which wiki elf is responsible >.> 16:19 < spevack> ianweller: well, if you have a chance to send your thoughts to the list tomorrow that would be great. otherwise, it will give us something to chat about on wednesday night. 16:19 < ianweller> ok 16:20 < ianweller> as mizmo mentioned in her mailing list post, it would make sense to have 4 separate categories based on experience with fedora 16:20 < spevack> link to post please? 16:20 < JonRob> ok, the least intuitive page title ever: 16:20 < JonRob> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites/LookFeel 16:20 < ianweller> https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-websites-list/2008-May/msg00320.html 16:20 < ianweller> JonRob: eew. 16:20 < ianweller> fix that if you could, please ;) 16:21 < JonRob> actually, that page needs revising 'cos it was just a dump from mo's post 16:21 < JonRob> but basically, each of those clearly has an activity linked 16:21 < spevack> I'm updating our task list, changing "new look and feel" to "usability testing" and noting that it is part of the larger "10 things for websites to do" topic 16:21 < ianweller> maybe i can use that page as my whiteboard later tonight 16:21 < JonRob> spevack: cool 16:21 < JonRob> ianweller: would be cool 16:22 < spevack> ok, so anything else we need to discuss on this right now, or can the rest be worked out between now and wed night on list, and then me and ian in person? 16:22 < ianweller> i'm thinking i can work on Websites/LookFeel and then we can discuss later. 16:23 < ianweller> this is an idea that recently returned to my head approxamately two hours ago, so its still in half-baked state 16:23 < spevack> sounds good to me. 16:23 < spevack> hmm, looking at the list of tasks... 16:23 * spevack tries to pick ones we haven't talked about for a while 16:23 < spevack> "Wiki Sponsorship Banners" 16:23 < ianweller> where's the task list? 16:23 < spevack> since I know JonRob is here 16:24 < spevack> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites/Tasks 16:24 < JonRob> hmm, guilty of letting this one slide! 16:24 < JonRob> i'll catch up with it this week 16:24 < JonRob> thanks for the reminder :) 16:24 < spevack> JonRob: that's ok -- remind me *what* that actually means 16:24 < spevack> this task, that is 16:24 < spevack> i know what catching up on stuff you've forgotten means, that's basically my life :) 16:25 < JonRob> ok - quaid's idea about having sponsorship/ownership of wiki pages 16:25 < spevack> right 16:25 < JonRob> we decided that one useful feature might be to have banners to denote who owns which page 16:25 < spevack> ok... 16:25 < JonRob> or not owns, but you know...sponsors/whatever 16:25 < spevack> so i guess the more interesting question is 16:25 < JonRob> and so i was going to have a chat with the art team about their thoughts on helping us out here 16:25 < JonRob> i think quite a few banners exist already 16:26 < ianweller> oh you mean the {{header}} thing? 16:26 < spevack> what is the current status of this whole "sponsorship/owner" idea? we talked about it a few weeks ago, i know there was some general controversy... does anyone know what is going on there? 16:26 < spevack> is quaid around? maybe stickster knows? 16:26 < ianweller> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Template:Header 16:26 < spevack> ok, so people are supposed to just be adding this to their pages? 16:26 < stickster> rr? 16:27 < spevack> stickster: just read back a bit, jump in if you have anything to say 16:27 < ianweller> if we're talking about using banners at the top of pages to say that this page is sponsored by a particular sub-project/SIG, we're doing that already. 16:27 < spevack> yeah, i've seen those 16:27 < spevack> and i like those -- it makes good sense 16:28 < JonRob> ianweller: cool - but i think we were talking about having every page sponsored (maybe - user pages) 16:28 < JonRob> maybe that's what we're doing? 16:28 < JonRob> but that template looks like what quaid was after 16:28 < spevack> I would phrase my question this way: 16:28 < ianweller> (i'm strongly against having pages sponsored by particular users, for various reasons) 16:28 < spevack> I see that we have templates, and the ability to show which "group" "owns 16:28 < spevack> " a particular page 16:28 < spevack> so 16:28 < spevack> given that 16:28 < spevack> can i remove those items from our task list? 16:28 < ianweller> i think the purpose though was automation 16:29 < spevack> well then... that is an entirely separate task :) 16:29 < JonRob> spevack: yep i think so 16:29 < ianweller> ah, correct. 16:29 * spevack is of the opinion that if it's not on the task list, it doesn't exist! 16:29 < ianweller> lol, agreed 16:29 < JonRob> spevack: i think there's another task about the automation - quaid investigating mediawiki plugins? 16:30 < spevack> ok, I will remove the old "sponsorship" tasks and replace them with a "make sure we can automate the sponsorship header stuff" task 16:30 < spevack> JonRob: yeah, i'll leave that one too 16:30 < ianweller> if we had a newer version of mediawiki, i could definitely write a bot to do it automatically. but that's another task for another time : 16:30 < ianweller> :P ** 16:30 < spevack> we'll talk about that next time quaid is at one of our meetings 16:30 < JonRob> ok 16:30 < ianweller> k 16:30 < spevack> ok, what else? I'll call myself out 16:30 < spevack> spins.fedoraproject.org 16:30 < mmcgrath> They spinnin! 16:30 < spevack> We're going to have a design session/meeting/workshop 16:30 < spevack> about this on Friday morning at 10 AM 16:30 < ianweller> mmcgrath: 8D 16:31 < spevack> Goals: 16:31 < spevack> 1) agree on the 5 top use cases 16:31 < spevack> 2) try to break out a few tasks that people can work on 16:31 < spevack> 3) have a dev version of the new site running somewhere 16:31 < spevack> on a test instance 16:31 < spevack> before the end of fudcon 16:31 < spevack> what other goals should we have? 16:32 < ianweller> get the word out that people have to come up with spins for each version of fedora? i see no fedora 9 spins. 16:32 < spevack> yeah, that's a big problem. 16:32 < spevack> and it's worth pursuing 16:32 < ianweller> is that website basically just the old torrents.fedoraproject.org page? 16:32 < spevack> right now, yeah 16:32 < ianweller> i see fudcon 2007 videos. those aren't spins :P 16:32 < ianweller> ok 16:32 < spevack> that's just there because we don't have anything else 16:33 < mmcgrath> ianweller: actually no, torrents and spins will be different sites. 16:33 < spevack> 4) review mizmo's mockups from like a year ago, which were really good 16:33 < ianweller> mmcgrath: i understand that. 16:33 < mmcgrath> ack :) 16:33 < ianweller> o O 16:33 < ianweller> that's a long time. 16:33 < spevack> 5) if we get to it, is to talk to kanarip about the infrastructure side of producing spins 16:34 < JonRob> wevisor? 16:34 < spevack> that is something the "spins sig" is supposed to be handling, under mandate from the Board, but it has had little progress lately 16:34 < spevack> JonRob: wevisor is yet another idea 16:34 < JonRob> ok - this is a complicated world! 16:34 < spevack> JonRob: ultimately, we have to separate the CREATION of spins from the DISTRIBUTION of spins 16:34 < spevack> we here in Websites land are focused on the distribution 16:34 < spevack> a spin exists -- it doesn't matter how or why -- all that matters to us is that it exists, and it has been Blessed. 16:35 < spevack> how do we distribute it> 16:35 * ianweller fails to see how that makes very much sense 16:35 < spevack> that's our topic. 16:35 < ianweller> oh well. 16:35 < spevack> for spins.fedoraproject.org 16:35 < mmcgrath> Actually I think the FEL got that mockup to an actual html page but never got it converted to a template. 16:35 < spevack> ianweller: what do you mean? 16:35 < ianweller> spevack: never mind, i think i get it now. 16:35 * ianweller needs more sleep at night... 16:35 < spevack> ianweller: well ask if you have a question 16:35 < ianweller> ok 16:36 < spevack> so anyway, my goal for fudcon 16:36 < JonRob> mmcgrath: http://chitlesh.fedorapeople.org/FEL/index.html 16:36 < mmcgrath> yep, I think thats the one. 16:36 < spevack> is for us to make progress on all the stuff in Spins Land that takes place *after* the spin has been created, tested, etc 16:36 < spevack> basically 16:36 < spevack> i want us to be able to say "here's your webapp for distributing all the Fedora custom spins" 16:36 < ianweller> ok 16:37 < spevack> "now, where are the spins? get your act together, spin sig?" 16:37 < ianweller> :3 works well for me 16:37 < spevack> any questions/comments? 16:37 < JonRob> sounds like a very sane approach 16:37 < ianweller> should we wait to make the new webapp live until we actually have spins? 16:37 < ianweller> like, sometime around f10 release 16:38 < spevack> ianweller: well, i figure we'll worry about that once we have it working the way we want on a test instance somewhere, with at least the F8 spins and the F9 spins that we do have populated in it. 16:38 < spevack> is that being too simplistic? 16:39 < ianweller> i see that as OK 16:40 < spevack> anyone else have any comments or concerns? 16:40 < spevack> Is there any New Business to discuss? 16:40 < JonRob> nope 16:40 < JonRob> spevack, just quickly 16:40 < JonRob> i noticed in your blog post you wanted to figure out FWN at FUDCon, i.e. automation 16:40 < spevack> yeah 16:41 < JonRob> can i suggest talking to bret mcmillan from rh - i think he's going to be there 16:41 < JonRob> probs at summit 16:41 < spevack> yeah, i know him well, and he and i have talked a bit 16:41 < JonRob> ok cool 16:41 < spevack> I'll also be in raleigh after summit, so we'll have time together 16:41 < JonRob> well he's packaging wordpress mu for our use 16:41 < spevack> yep 16:41 < JonRob> thought i'd let you know 16:41 < JonRob> ah cool :) 16:41 < spevack> I'm hoping he's at summit, and can come to that session 16:41 < JonRob> you guys should be able to make some good progress! 16:41 < spevack> or at least give me an update that i can use in that session 16:42 < spevack> ok, last thing for tonight 16:42 < spevack> The license question that is open. 16:42 < spevack> I will try to talk to spot about this at fudcon 16:42 < spevack> and just get it taken care of 16:42 < spevack> but he'll be very busy, so it might continue to linger 16:43 < JonRob> np - sure it will sort soon enough :) 16:43 < fchiulli> JonRob: What's the status of wordpress mu? 16:44 < JonRob> fchiulli: i believe bret has packages, but is waiting on a security fix to be pushed upstream before putting them in for review 16:45 < fchiulli> JonRob: Thanks. 16:45 < spevack> oh, that's farther along than i thought then 16:45 < spevack> cool 16:45 < JonRob> yeah, he just said upstream are being slow 16:45 < spevack> ok gentlemen, anything else for tonight? 16:45 < JonRob> nope 16:45 * ianweller doesn't know of anything 16:45 < spevack> mmcgrath: anything you want to talk about? 16:45 < mmcgrath> Nope, looking forward to FUDCon next week. 16:45 < spevack> mmcgrath, ianweller: hope you both have safe travel to FUDCon 16:46 < mmcgrath> thanks! 16:46 < ianweller> thanks :) 16:46 < JonRob> yeah - hope you all enjoy it! 16:46 < spevack> and I will see you guys in the next couple days 16:46 < ianweller> ok :) 16:46 < spevack> thanks for coming to the meeting, all 16:46 < spevack> --------------------------------------
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