On Monday 31 May 2010, Máirín Duffy wrote:
>On Mon, 2010-05-31 at 22:51 +0000, g wrote:
>> Máirín Duffy wrote:
>> > On Sat, 2010-05-29 at 16:32 +0000, g wrote:
>> >> where was posting of new design for list members to view new design?
>> >
>> > On the lists (note the 's' there) where people make posts about
>> > websites and design in Fedora. If you're not interested in websites
>> > and design in the Fedora project, then you likely weren't subscribed
>> > to those lists.
>>
>> that is correct. but if i where a member of website design, i would
>> insure that all of *community* was notified of intent to make change and
>> not just dump changes on them and take offense of there opinions.
>
>When would you have time to do actual website design?
>
>> after all, when you design a web page, you are expressing opinion of how
>> something should look. therefore, to be mature, you should not take
>> offense to someone else's opinion.
>
>You are not in any position to give personal advice without it coming
>across in a manner that you I am sure you would not want to purposefully
>aim for. Personal commentary like this doesn't have any place in this
>discussion so let's try to avoid it, okay?
Would you perhaps need a ladder to reach the saddle of that horse?
>If you disagree with a design for something implemented in Fedora, here
>are some examples of inappropriate reactions (all witnessed in this
>thread unfortunately):
>
>1 - Rant that nobody asked for YOUR opinion, especially when feedback
>was actually solicited over a period of several months across several
>forums that are heavily frequented by Fedora users and contributors
>alike.
A few of said users maybe, but by not copying to this list, you probably
bypassed, and here I'm guessing without even a scientific basis here, 85% of
the everyday users.
>2 - Spread conspiracy theories about how the design took place in
>secret, when the design actually took place in an open and transparent
>manner, with frequent updates to the design posted over a period of
>months.
As I am not subscribed to the lists you maintain were the proper ones for
web design, it was, as far as we could see, done in secret.
>3 - Attack the designers personally, as their { intellect | design
>qualifications | personal taste | people skills | value as a human
>being } are obviously not good enough for Fedora.
>
>4 - Belittle the designer, making remarks and suppositions about their
>personal traits, and give them some motherly/fatherly advice on how they
>must behave according to your preferences and values, and tell them
>everything they say is 'BS' when they attempt to provide the reasoning
>behind the design decisions that took place.
For that which I did, I apologize.
>If you pay attention to the emails I've written on this thread, I've not
>taken offense at anyone's opinion of the website. Where I have taken
>offense is where I've been personally insulted, my skills as a designer
>and commitment to Fedora and its community have been questioned, and
>where I was told that I am full of 'BS'.
>
>I would *LOVE* to hear more actual feedback on the website and its
>design - we've been asking for it for months. This thread shows clearly
>that this list is apparently not a great place to get it - it makes it
>clear that asking for feedback on this particular list in the first
>place would have been a bad idea.
>
I have to disagree milady. Had this list, where the majority of the 'users'
are subscribed, been asked to go take a look at the proposed site, I think
the level of rancor expressed by some of us, myself included, would have
been virtually non-existent. The major question most of us asked is where
did the torrents go? Secondarily I commented about the font sizes, which
seemed excessively large, wasting screen space for those who do not have a
high resolution monitor. Even on my 1680x1050 screen, there was a lot of
scrolling required to see the whole page.
>> > If you are interested in websites and design in Fedora and you are not
>> > subscribed to those lists, then I suggest that you subscribe to them
>> > now, unless you plan to continue on those lists in the manner you have
>> > carried on in this list. People actually attempt to get work done in
>> > those lists, and we really don't need them cluttered up with
>> > ridiculously unproductive threads like this.
>>
>> that is a biased statement and shows a lacking of others opinion.
>
>How is it biased?
By appearing to have a heavy disdain for the opinions of the (apparently
unwashed in your opinion) fedora _users_. We are just the rabble I guess.
We are not qualified to comment one way or the other. As you see it...
>~m
>
Now, this topic has worn out its welcome, and I apologize to the list for
tossing yet another gallon of K2 on the fire. Please let it die, or better
yet, put it out of its misery.
--
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
I just forgot my whole philosophy of life!!!
--
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