On Mon, 2007-02-05 at 13:15 +0200, Gilboa Davara wrote: > On Sun, 2007-02-04 at 15:47 -0600, Aaron Konstam wrote: > > I have found FC6 to be the least installable of all the Fedoras. > > That is my conclusion but first some caveats. I am trying to run it on a > > year 2000 Dell Optiplex GX1p. This machine ran FCx (x<6) with minimum > > problems. It is an old machine but FC6 has given me more serious > > trouble with the installation than and other Fedoras. > > > > On the bright side it has been a learning experience but I am full of > > anxiety as to what will happen with FC7. There is something wrong with > > its construction and let me list some of the more serious problems. > > Maybe it is only with older machines but I have seen others having > > similar problems. > > > > 1. shutdown would not turn off the machine. Finally fixed with 4 months > > of hitting my head against the wall. > > > > 2. The system did not recognize my sound card. It showed up in the early > > boot messages but then it was lost. lspci did not list it, and it did > > not show up in modprobe.conf and when the appropriate lines were put in > > the file they were ignored. Again after much turmoil the modprobe had > > to be run in rc.local. > > > > 3. Once sound was enabled use of sound was ephemeral. With updates, CD > > playing which worked stopped working. > > > > 4. Getting various video and audio sources to play also came and went. > > > > 5. firefox configuration to use plugins properly was especially > > confusing and tedious. > > > > 6. Using system-config-httpd to configure the web server does not really > > work and caused me the hidden problem of ending up with two Listen > > commands in the configuration files which took a while to trouble shoot. > > > > 7. And today's special, rpm's that are removed by yum erase for > > dependencies are not re-installed with a yum install > > > > There were other things but these were the biggies. Now I ma not trying > > to start a rant and for people to say it worked for me is not helpful. > > What was helpful in getting things to work was advice I received from > > people on the list. Again all this worked fairly well in previous > > Fedoras on this machine so I can't really blame the machine. > > I am not bitter I just want the installation process to be smoother and > > for it to work as it has previously. > > -- > > Aaron Konstam <akonstam@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > > > > Forgive my bluntness, but if you are not looking to start a rant thread, > what exactly -are- you trying to achieve? He's airing how he feels, is this not allowed? > You refuse to report the bugs in an organize fashion. When it comes to non-supported issues, he can't. > You mix software and hardware problems. Trouble shooting with a shotgun, it happens and is part of a very severe learning curve to use linux of any flavor. I've asked so many ignorant questions for years, that I had quite a few answers stored up. Got a job at RedHat with out any formal training at all. I learned at the suffrage of others to whom I will be eternally grateful. I'm sure you did as well. So, we all suffer a little to pay back by paying forward. > You seem to complain bout missing support for patent encumbered media > types - ignoring the fact that these doesn't having nothing to do with > Fedora to begin with. So does everyone else on this list, but you're zeroing in on him. Give JoAnne or Anne a hard time and see what happens. I'd pay good money to see that one. :) > As I see it, you are either part of the problem or part of the problem > or part of the solution. > As you refuse to help (E.g. by reporting bugs, etc) , you are part of > the problem. You said "refuse", he never -refused- to do that. Bugzilla is a pain to use for a newbie and even a flatworm turns from pain if you light a match next to it. So, more often than not, I'll question my own problem to the list to air it, to make sure I'm not putting in a bugzilla report that might be my own ignorant fault and a waste of a developers time. We all hate to look stupid instead of just ignorant. Teamwork is not a bad thing, is it? I hate to see aggressive attacks, "blaming" and "shoulding" are considered aggressive, not assertive. "Name calling", "Labeling", "My Way or the Highway", "Failure of others to live up to my expectations", these are all common elements of criminal thinking (common thought patterns leading to an offense) and are best avoided by careful consideration and taking perspectives. It's really sad to see someone whose "shoulding" covertly escalated to take on a darker form, and found himself standing in a chow line blinking and wondering just how the hell he got there. It's sad as Hell. And, the road to there is wide. We had one guy that just got out after doing 38 years for murdering his best friend for "Not doin' what I said." He would have been much better off had he understood that a simple "stop-switch" would have saved him that conviction 38 years ago. His one "should" got him that time. Imagine never knowing what an ATM card was for or how to use it. He's a really old man who has missed much now, all because someone else didn't live up to his expectations. So, this was on my mind while processing all the "shoulds" I'm reading on the Bugzilla issue. So, this is not pointed solely at you, Gilboa, but others as well. It's hard for me not to do it too, I am just as guilty. But I'm pointing out that it is considered not good nor healthy to do. Ric -- ================================================ My father, Victor Moore (Vic) used to say: "There are two Great Sins in the world... ..the Sin of Ignorance, and the Sin of Stupidity. Only the former may be overcome." R.I.P. Dad. Linux user# 44256 Sign up at: http://counter.li.org/ http://www.sourceforge.net/projects/oar http://www.wayward4now.net ================================================
