On Fri, Feb 20, 2009 at 1:16 AM, Kevin Kofler wrote: > Orcan Ogetbil wrote: >> Sure. Here is some kaffeine crash-on-exit. I believe I have all the > [crash in libselinux.so.1] >> Here is a k3b crash-on-exit: > [likewise] > > Are these the only KDE 3 apps crashing? We have reports about this indeed, > we thought it was caused by something linked in by > xine-lib-extras-freeworld (maybe ffmpeg), not by kdelibs3, but kdelibs3 > might be a common point we haven't thought of yet. Rex? > Yes. Only KDE3 applications crash on exit. Many of them crash. Exceptions that I found are kile, konversation. >> What else do I need other than what debuginfo-install k3b kaffeine >> installs? > > The missing debuginfo package is probably the one for libselinux, but I > don't think we need it, the bug is not there anyway, it's a memory > corruption somewhere which makes libselinux fail its cleanups. The latest > news I have is that something tries calling close(-1) according to > Valgrind, but we haven't found the offender yet (Valgrind just warns about > the invalid parameter to close() but produces no backtrace for that). > >> Unmaintained doesn't necessarily mean bad. If something is fully >> functional then it can go unmaintained for years. gwenview is not >> light enough. > > KDE is about being good, not about being light. ;-) > Maybe KDE is not, but kuickshow was about being light. There's nothing comparable to kuickshow now. >> Meanwhile, I have nothing against GTK+ 1. > > It has been obsolete for 7 years, it has got no updates whatsoever from > upstream, not even bugfixes, for 8 years (they stopped updating it even > before GTK+ 2 was officially released) and who knows how many of the > security issues found and fixed in GTK+ 2 also apply to it and nobody > noticed (other than blackhats). > > How long should such a compat lib be kept on life support? I think we've > reached the point where the apps which are still using it are either dead > themselves (and thus should be EOLed along with the ancient compat lib) or > have upstreams which just don't care about the problem (in which case > telling them they'll be dropped from Fedora if they don't port to to > current libs might get them moving - if not, their upstream isn't any more > useful than a dead one and the package should be EOLed as unmaintainable). > Sorry, I don't get this "unmaintained <-> bad" logic. Sure, there is a finite probability that something unmaintained will turn bad at some point. But from our experience, I sadly admit that something well-maintained may also turn bad. Whenever there's demand, there should be supply. >> The best audio application still uses GTK+, and that, I think, is a >> sufficient proof that GTK+ is better than GTK2+. > > Don't tell me you mean XMMS with "the best audio application"... > I did not need to name it. You did not need to name it either. Best is best. I do admit that amarok had its prime time at some point. But as every other audio application, it lost (or in upstream language: changed) its vision. The best one is still there. It never fails me. > There are plenty of alternatives which don't rely on obsolete libraries, > including Audacious which is based on XMMS code and keeps its user > interface. > >> I also started thinking that all we need to swallow is that Qt3 is >> better than Qt4. > > It's not. > > And even if it was, that wouldn't change the fact that it's deprecated and > no longer maintained by upstream and packages using it need to be migrated > off it ASAP. > > The same thing I said about GTK+ 1 also applies to Qt 3: I don't think it > makes sense to keep it around forever. For a few years, to give apps time > to port, sure, definitely. But forever, no. > I do respect your thoughts but I do not agree with them. If version X of a library (or application) is better then version X+1, then X shall not be abandoned. If its upstream doesn't care about the version X anymore, it is my responsibility (as a power user and a packager) to tell them that they are doing wrong. I do think that reverting F-11 to KDE3 would be a striking lesson to upstream. But who am I anyways... >> If by "font acceleration" you mean "Anti-aliasing", turning it off >> doesn't do any good. kfontview still shows a blank window. If by "font >> acceleration" you mean something else, can you be a little more >> specific? > > Try: > nvidia-settings -a GlyphCache=0 > Didn't help. I still get blank window with kfontview. I also removed all kfontview related bits from ~/.kde, it didn't help. > Completely untested, of course, as I don't have NVidia sh*t. > >> Yes, nvidia sucks by not open sourcing their driver. But I do not have >> another choice. > > Yes, you have the choice to buy supported hardware. NVidia sh*t is NOT > supported. > > Kevin Kofler > I really have no other choice right now. I do not think the supported hardware vendors will donate me a 200$ graphics card. Cheers, Orcan
