----- Original Message -----
> From: "Kai Qiang Wu" <wkqwu@xxxxxxxxxx>
> To: "Steve Gordon" <sgordon@xxxxxxxxxx>
> Cc: "Ton Ngo" <ton@xxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Saturday, March 12, 2016 5:07:17 AM
> Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum] Discussion of supporting
> single/multiple OS distro
> Hi Steve，
> I think what you did is rpm version, here is my finding:
> [minion@k8-pdvmggl3ys-0-cdruybssooyh-kube-master-vtartl7oubyc ~]$ rpm -qa |
> grep kubernetes
> kubernetes-1.1.0-0.17.git388061f.fc23.x86_64
> kubernetes-node-1.1.0-0.17.git388061f.fc23.x86_64
> kubernetes-client-1.1.0-0.17.git388061f.fc23.x86_64
> kubernetes-master-1.1.0-0.17.git388061f.fc23.x86_64
> [minion@k8-pdvmggl3ys-0-cdruybssooyh-kube-master-vtartl7oubyc ~]$ kubectl
> version
> Client Version: version.Info{Major:"1", Minor:"0", GitVersion:"v1.0.6",
> GitCommit:"388061f00f0d9e4d641f9ed4971c775e1654579d GitTreeState:"clean"}
> Server Version: version.Info{Major:"1", Minor:"0", GitVersion:"v1.0.6",
> GitCommit:"388061f00f0d9e4d641f9ed4971c775e1654579d GitTreeState:"clean"}
> It seems we should trust kubectl version, it is final version, it said
> v1.0.6.
Adding cloud@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx. Folks, can you explain the reason for the discrepancy between the packages that appear to have been used to build the image and the tools themselves? Specifically looking at Fedora-Cloud-Atomic-23-20160308.x86_64.qcow2
Thanks,
Steve
> Thanks
> Best Wishes,
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Kai Qiang Wu (吴开强 Kennan）
> IBM China System and Technology Lab, Beijing
> E-mail: wkqwu@xxxxxxxxxx
> Tel: 86-10-82451647
> Address: Building 28(Ring Building), ZhongGuanCun Software Park,
> No.8 Dong Bei Wang West Road, Haidian District Beijing P.R.China 100193
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Follow your heart. You are miracle!
> Steve Gordon ---12/03/2016 12:46:50 am-------- Original Message ----- > From:
> "Kai Qiang Wu" <wkqwu@xxxxxxxxxx>
> From: Steve Gordon <sgordon@xxxxxxxxxx>
> To: Kai Qiang Wu/China/IBM@IBMCN
> Cc: Ton Ngo <ton@xxxxxxxxxx>
> Date: 12/03/2016 12:46 am
> Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum] Discussion of supporting
> single/multiple OS distro
> ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Kai Qiang Wu" <wkqwu@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > To: "Steve Gordon" <sgordon@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > Cc: "Ton Ngo" <ton@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > Sent: Friday, March 11, 2016 3:58:04 AM
> > Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum] Discussion of supporting
> > single/multiple OS distro
> > Hi Steve，
> > I tried the link you gave me
> > https://getfedora.org/en/cloud/download/atomic.html
> > and download the atomic 23 image,
> > And deploy with Magnum, and login in server, and found it is still
> > GitVersion: V1.0.6
> > Could you confirm is it v1.1.0 ? From my test, I did not find it such case.
> I am simply loading the image up in virt-manager:
> $ sudo qemu-img create -f qcow2 -o preallocation=metadata
> /var/lib/libvirt/images/Test-Fedora-Cloud-Atomic-23-20160308.x86_64.qcow2
> 50G
> $ sudo virt-resize --expand /dev/vda1
> /home/sgordon/Downloads/Fedora-Cloud-Atomic-23-20160308.x86_64.qcow2
> /var/lib/libvirt/images/Test-Fedora-Cloud-Atomic-23-20160308.x86_64.qcow2
> ...create new VM from disk image in virt-manager and attach init.iso CD-ROM
> with metadata, ssh in...
> $ cat /etc/redhat-release
> Fedora release 23 (Twenty Three)
> $ rpm -qa | grep kubernetes
> kubernetes-1.1.0-0.17.git388061f.fc23.x86_64
> kubernetes-node-1.1.0-0.17.git388061f.fc23.x86_64
> kubernetes-client-1.1.0-0.17.git388061f.fc23.x86_64
> kubernetes-master-1.1.0-0.17.git388061f.fc23.x86_64
> Are you sure Magnum isn't modifying it?
> -Steve
> > Thanks
> > Best Wishes,
> > --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Kai Qiang Wu (吴开强 Kennan）
> > IBM China System and Technology Lab, Beijing
> > E-mail: wkqwu@xxxxxxxxxx
> > Tel: 86-10-82451647
> > Address: Building 28(Ring Building), ZhongGuanCun Software Park,
> > No.8 Dong Bei Wang West Road, Haidian District Beijing P.R.China 100193
> > --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Follow your heart. You are miracle!
> > Steve Gordon ---11/03/2016 10:46:06 am-------- Original Message ----- >
> > From:
> > "Kai Qiang Wu" <wkqwu@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > From: Steve Gordon <sgordon@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > To: Kai Qiang Wu/China/IBM@IBMCN
> > Cc: Ton Ngo <ton@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > Date: 11/03/2016 10:46 am
> > Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum] Discussion of supporting
> > single/multiple OS distro
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Kai Qiang Wu" <wkqwu@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > > To: "Steve Gordon" <sgordon@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > > Cc: "Ton Ngo" <ton@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > > Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 9:00:09 PM
> > > Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum] Discussion of supporting
> > > single/multiple OS distro
> > > Hi Steve,
> > > Glad to know above information, It seems clearer to me now.
> > > Fedora atomic is updated more frequent, (as you said maybe two-weekly)
> > > Each
> > > update is well tested and ready for production, each new image just
> > > include
> > > some new version (kubernetes and docker). Is it ?
> > Yes, though major rebases/updates may still have to wait for e.g. Fedora
> > Atomic 24. The easiest way to track when new updates are released is to
> > join
> > the cloud@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx list.
> > -Steve
> > > I asked before, because I thought those image was only used for internal
> > > test. Which can be a gap for customer use. As customer would only want to
> > > use
> > > official release image. (which means community fully supported)
> > > Thanks
> > > Best Wishes,
> > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > Kai Qiang Wu (吴开强 Kennan）
> > > IBM China System and Technology Lab, Beijing
> > > E-mail: wkqwu@xxxxxxxxxx
> > > Tel: 86-10-82451647
> > > Address: Building 28(Ring Building), ZhongGuanCun Software Park,
> > > No.8 Dong Bei Wang West Road, Haidian District Beijing P.R.China 100193
> > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > Follow your heart. You are miracle!
> > > Steve Gordon ---11/03/2016 09:49:36 am-------- Original Message ----- >
> > > From:
> > > "Kai Qiang Wu" <wkqwu@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > > From: Steve Gordon <sgordon@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > > To: Kai Qiang Wu/China/IBM@IBMCN
> > > Cc: Ton Ngo <ton@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > > Date: 11/03/2016 09:49 am
> > > Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum] Discussion of supporting
> > > single/multiple OS distro
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: "Kai Qiang Wu" <wkqwu@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > > > To: "Steve Gordon" <sgordon@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > > >
> > > > Hi Steve,
> > > >
> > > > What's the difference between those images ? Is that daily build test
> > > > image ? Not GA official release image ?(Like Redhat linux 7.0)
> > > No, that is the Fedora Atomic 23 image - which is updated ("GA" if you
> > > will)
> > > on a regular basis.
> > > > I did not expect user have many images which could waste test effort in
> > > > our
> > > > side. I expect it would be one official release image.
> > > RHEL/CentOS Atomic are updated less regularly but of course this also
> > > means
> > > using slightly older versions of included components.
> > > > If we have, could you give a link what's the official atomic 23 image ?
> > > The link to the official atomic 23 image is the one I already gave you:
> > > https://getfedora.org/en/cloud/download/atomic.html
> > > There is a new official Fedora Atomic 23 image on a regular basis. The
> > > above
> > > link will always contain the latest Fedora Atomic release. It seems to me
> > > you are complaining that the original Fedora Atomic 23 did not have
> > > kubernetes-1.1.0 (which was released shortly *after* Fedora 23 was
> > > released)
> > > but also complaining that the image is re-spun often enough to pick up
> > > such
> > > changes? Similarly the Magnum community at large's most frequent
> > > complaint
> > > (and justification for building special/custom images) is that Fedora
> > > Atomic
> > > does not update *frequently enough* or does not have new enough versions
> > > of
> > > the key components. It is not clear to me what your desired/expected
> > > outcome
> > > is?
> > > -Steve
> > > >
> > > > Thanks
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Best Wishes,
> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > Kai Qiang Wu (吴开强 Kennan）
> > > > IBM China System and Technology Lab, Beijing
> > > >
> > > > E-mail: wkqwu@xxxxxxxxxx
> > > > Tel: 86-10-82451647
> > > > Address: Building 28(Ring Building), ZhongGuanCun Software Park,
> > > > No.8 Dong Bei Wang West Road, Haidian District Beijing P.R.China
> > > > 100193
> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > Follow your heart. You are miracle!
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > From: Steve Gordon <sgordon@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > > > To: Kai Qiang Wu/China/IBM@IBMCN
> > > > Date: 10/03/2016 11:13 pm
> > > > Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum] Discussion of supporting
> > > > single/multiple OS distro
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > From: "Kai Qiang Wu" <wkqwu@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > > > > To: "Steve Gordon" <sgordon@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > > > >
> > > > > Yes, I noticed that,
> > > > >
> > > > > But from our guys test result, atomic 23 was integrated with
> > > > > kubernetes
> > > > > 1.0.6, not 1.1.0.
> > > > >
> > > > > Which I think it is not good for some features (like cinder volume
> > > > > plugin
> > > > > support).
> > > >
> > > > As I said, it is updated two-weekly. The versions in the earlier email
> > > > are
> > > > present in the latest F23 Atomic images. Specifically:
> > > >
> > > > > > Fedora-Cloud-Atomic-23-20160223.x86_64.qcow2:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > docker-1.9.1
> > > > > > flannel-0.5.4
> > > > > > kubernetes-1.1.0
> > > > > > etcd-2.2.1
> > > >
> > > > I loaded the image myself and confirmed this.
> > > >
> > > > -Steve
> > > >
> > > > > Thanks
> > > > >
> > > > > Best Wishes,
> > > > >
> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > > > Kai Qiang Wu (吴开强 Kennan）
> > > > > IBM China System and Technology Lab, Beijing
> > > > >
> > > > > E-mail: wkqwu@xxxxxxxxxx
> > > > > Tel: 86-10-82451647
> > > > > Address: Building 28(Ring Building), ZhongGuanCun Software Park,
> > > > > No.8 Dong Bei Wang West Road, Haidian District Beijing P.R.China
> > > > > 100193
> > > > >
> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > > > Follow your heart. You are miracle!
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > From: Steve Gordon <sgordon@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > > > > To: Kai Qiang Wu/China/IBM@IBMCN
> > > > > Date: 10/03/2016 09:59 pm
> > > > > Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum] Discussion of
> > > > supporting
> > > > > single/multiple OS distro
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > > From: "Kai Qiang Wu" <wkqwu@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > > > > > To: sgordon@xxxxxxxxxx
> > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, March 9, 2016 9:15:05 PM
> > > > > > Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum] Discussion
> > > > of
> > > > > supporting single/multiple
> > > > OS distro
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Hi Steve,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Where can I get integrated software versions in Atomic 23 ? (As you
> > > > > > mentioned it include kubernetes v1.10 and docker 1.9.1 etc)
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Do we have any official link for that as refer ?
> > > > >
> > > > > Hi Kai,
> > > > >
> > > > > I was pulling the latest image from this location:
> > > > >
> > > > > https://getfedora.org/en/cloud/download/atomic.html
> > > > >
> > > > > These images are updated every 2 weeks or so, although major rebases
> > > > (e.g.
> > > > > moving to docker 1.10) will still likely only occur in rawhide
> > > > development
> > > > > for F24. Note that there are some changes required to use an F23
> > > > > based
> > > > > Atomic:
> > > > >
> > > > > https://review.openstack.org/#/c/276232/
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks,
> > > > >
> > > > > Steve
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > > Thanks
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Best Wishes,
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > > Kai Qiang Wu (吴开强 Kennan）
> > > > > > IBM China System and Technology Lab, Beijing
> > > > > >
> > > > > > E-mail: wkqwu@xxxxxxxxxx
> > > > > > Tel: 86-10-82451647
> > > > > > Address: Building 28(Ring Building), ZhongGuanCun Software Park,
> > > > > > No.8 Dong Bei Wang West Road, Haidian District Beijing
> > > > P.R.China
> > > > > > 100193
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > > Follow your heart. You are miracle!
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > From: Steve Gordon <sgordon@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > > > > > To: "OpenStack Development Mailing List (not
> > > > for usage questions)"
> > > > > > <openstack-dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > > > > > Cc: Josh Berkus <jberkus@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > > > > > Date: 01/03/2016 10:30 pm
> > > > > > Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum]
> > > > Discussion of
> > > > > supporting
> > > > > > single/multiple OS distro
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > > > From: "Kai Qiang Wu" <wkqwu@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > > > > > > To: "OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage
> > > > > > > questions)"
> > > > > > <openstack-dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > > > > > > Cc: "Josh Berkus" <jberkus@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > We found some issue about atomic host run some docker volume
> > > > > > > plugin,
> > > > > > while
> > > > > > > atomic and docker volume plugin both not sure what's the root
> > > > > > > cause
> > > > of
> > > > > > > that.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > here is the link
> > > > > > > https://github.com/docker/docker/issues/18005#issuecomment-190215862
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Thanks for highlighting this PR, I'll add it to my list.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > Also I did not find atomic image update quickly, ( but k8s and
> > > > > > > docker
> > > > > > both
> > > > > > > release quickly, which can lacks of new feature applied in our
> > > > > > > development), I think atomic have a gap for that.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > This is definitely likely to continue to be a real issue
> > > > > > particularly
> > > > > > w.r.t. docker itself - containerization of k8s, flannel, and etcd
> > > > > > will
> > > > > > alleviate at least some of the pain though as does the fact that
> > > > updates
> > > > > > are now in fact being pushed out every couple of weeks. As it
> > > > > > stands
> > > > the
> > > > > > official Fedora Atomic images appear to actually contain equivalent
> > > > > > or
> > > > > > newer components than the custom builds at
> > > > > > https://fedorapeople.org/groups/magnum/ (?), e.g.:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Fedora-Cloud-Atomic-23-20160223.x86_64.qcow2:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > docker-1.9.1
> > > > > > flannel-0.5.4
> > > > > > kubernetes-1.1.0
> > > > > > etcd-2.2.1
> > > > > >
> > > > > > fedora-21-7.qcow2:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > docker-1.9.1
> > > > > > flannel-0.5.0
> > > > > > kubernetes-1.1.0
> > > > > > etcd-2.0.13
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I digress though, as I said in the follow up either way it doesn't
> > > > > > seem
> > > > > to
> > > > > > me like only having support for one image would be a win for users
> > > > > > -
> > > > > > it
> > > > > > does make sense though to expect more of the work to support each
> > > > > > image
> > > > > to
> > > > > > come from the folks interested in maintaining that support though
> > > > > > than
> > > > > > being spread across the entire magnum team.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Thanks,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Steve
> > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > Kai Qiang Wu (吴开强 Kennan）
> > > > > > > IBM China System and Technology Lab, Beijing
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > E-mail: wkqwu@xxxxxxxxxx
> > > > > > > Tel: 86-10-82451647
> > > > > > > Address: Building 28(Ring Building), ZhongGuanCun Software Park,
> > > > > > > No.8 Dong Bei Wang West Road, Haidian District Beijing
> > > > > P.R.China
> > > > > > > 100193
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > Follow your heart. You are miracle!
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > From: Steve Gordon
> > > > <sgordon@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > > > > > > To: Guz Egor
> > > > <guz_egor@xxxxxxxxx>, "OpenStack
> > > > > Development Mailing
> > > > > > > List (not for usage questions)"
> > > > > > > <openstack-dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > > > > > > Cc: Josh Berkus
> > > > <jberkus@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > > > > > > Date: 01/03/2016 08:19
> > > > pm
> > > > > > > Subject: Re:
> > > > [openstack-dev] [magnum]
> > > > > Discussion of
> > > > > > supporting
> > > > > > > single/multiple
> > > > OS distro
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > > > > From: "Guz Egor" <guz_egor@xxxxxxxxx>
> > > > > > > > To: "OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage
> > > > > > > > questions)"
> > > > > > > <openstack-dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Adrian,
> > > > > > > > I disagree, host OS is very important for operators because of
> > > > > > > integration
> > > > > > > > with all internal tools/repos/etc.
> > > > > > > > I think it make sense to limit OS support in Magnum main
> > > > > > > > source.
> > > > But
> > > > > > not
> > > > > > > sure
> > > > > > > > that Fedora Atomic is right choice,first of all there is no
> > > > > > documentation
> > > > > > > > about it and I don't think it's used/tested a lot by
> > > > Docker/Kub/Mesos
> > > > > > > > community.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Project Atomic documentation for the most part lives here:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > http://www.projectatomic.io/docs/
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > To help us improve it, it would be useful to know what you think
> > > > > > > is
> > > > > > > missing. E.g. I saw recently in the IRC channel it was discussed
> > > > > > > that
> > > > > > there
> > > > > > > is no documentation on (re)building the image but this is the
> > > > > > > first
> > > > hit
> > > > > > in
> > > > > > > a Google search for same and it seems to largely match what has
> > > > > > > been
> > > > > > copied
> > > > > > > into Magnum's docs for same:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > http://www.projectatomic.io/blog/2014/08/build-your-own-atomic-centos-or-fedora/
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I have no doubt that there are areas where the documentation is
> > > > > lacking,
> > > > > > > but it's difficult to resolve a claim that there is no
> > > > > > > documentation
> > > > at
> > > > > > > all. I recently kicked off a thread over on the atomic list to
> > > > > > > try
> > > > and
> > > > > > > relay some of the concerns that were raised on this list and in
> > > > > > > the
> > > > IRC
> > > > > > > channel recently, it would be great if Magnum folks could chime
> > > > > > > in
> > > > with
> > > > > > > more specifics:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > https://lists.projectatomic.io/projectatomic-archives/atomic/2016-February/thread.html#00009
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Separately I had asked about containerization of
> > > > > kubernetes/etcd/flannel
> > > > > > > which remains outstanding:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/cloud@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx/thread/XICO4NJCTPI43AWG332EIM2HNFYPZ6ON/
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Fedora Atomic builds do seem to be hitting their planned two
> > > > > > > weekly
> > > > > > update
> > > > > > > cadence now though which may alleviate this concern at least
> > > > > > > somewhat
> > > > > in
> > > > > > > the interim:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/cloud@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx/thread/CW5BQS3ODAVYJGAJGAZ6UA3XQMKEISVJ/
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > https://fedorahosted.org/cloud/ticket/139
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Thanks,
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Steve
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > It make sense to go with Ubuntu (I believe it's still most
> > > > > > > > adopted
> > > > > > > > platform in all three COEs and OpenStack deployments) and
> > > > CoreOS
> > > > > > (is
> > > > > > > > highly adopted/tested in Kub community and Mesosphere DCOS uses
> > > > > > > > it
> > > > as
> > > > > > > well).
> > > > > > > > We can implement CoreOS support as driver and users can use it
> > > > > > > > as
> > > > > > > reference
> > > > > > > > implementation.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > --- Egor
> > > > > > > > From: Adrian Otto <adrian.otto@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > > > > > > > To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage
> > > > > > > > questions)
> > > > > > > > <openstack-dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > > > > > > > Sent: Monday, February 29, 2016 10:36 AM
> > > > > > > > Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum] Discussion of supporting
> > > > > > > > single/multiple OS distro
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Consider this: Which OS runs on the bay nodes is not important
> > > > > > > > to
> > > > end
> > > > > > > users.
> > > > > > > > What matters to users is the environments their containers
> > > > > > > > execute
> > > > > in,
> > > > > > > which
> > > > > > > > has only one thing in common with the bay node OS: the kernel.
> > > > > > > > The
> > > > > > linux
> > > > > > > > syscall interface is stable enough that the various linux
> > > > > distributions
> > > > > > > can
> > > > > > > > all run concurrently in neighboring containers sharing same
> > > > > > > > kernel.
> > > > > > There
> > > > > > > is
> > > > > > > > really no material reason why the bay OS choice must match what
> > > > > distro
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > container is based on. Although I’m persuaded by Hongbin’s
> > > > > > > > concern
> > > > to
> > > > > > > > mitigate risk of future changes WRT whatever OS distro is the
> > > > > > prevailing
> > > > > > > one
> > > > > > > > for bay nodes, there are a few items of concern about duality
> > > > > > > > I’d
> > > > > like
> > > > > > to
> > > > > > > > zero in on:
> > > > > > > > 1) Participation from Magnum contributors to support the CoreOS
> > > > > > specific
> > > > > > > > template features has been weak in recent months. By
> > > > > > > > comparison,
> > > > > > > > participation relating to Fedora/Atomic have been much
> > > > > > > > stronger.
> > > > > > > > 2) Properly testing multiple bay node OS distros (would)
> > > > > significantly
> > > > > > > > increase the run time and complexity of our functional tests.
> > > > > > > > 3) Having support for multiple bay node OS choices requires
> > > > > > > > more
> > > > > > > extensive
> > > > > > > > documentation, and more comprehensive troubleshooting details.
> > > > > > > > If we proceed with just one supported disto for bay nodes, and
> > > > offer
> > > > > > > > extensibility points to allow alternates to be used in place of
> > > > > > > > it,
> > > > > we
> > > > > > > > should be able to address the risk concern of the chosen distro
> > > > > > > > by
> > > > > > > selecting
> > > > > > > > an alternate when that change is needed, by using those
> > > > extensibility
> > > > > > > > points. These include the ability to specify your own bay
> > > > > > > > image,
> > > > and
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > ability to use your own associated Heat template.
> > > > > > > > I see value in risk mitigation, it may make sense to simplify
> > > > > > > > in
> > > > the
> > > > > > > short
> > > > > > > > term and address that need when it becomes necessary. My point
> > > > > > > > of
> > > > > view
> > > > > > > might
> > > > > > > > be different if we had contributors willing and ready to
> > > > > > > > address
> > > > the
> > > > > > > variety
> > > > > > > > of drawbacks that accompany the strategy of supporting multiple
> > > > > > > > bay
> > > > > > node
> > > > > > > OS
> > > > > > > > choices. In absence of such a community interest, my preference
> > > > > > > > is
> > > > to
> > > > > > > > simplify to increase our velocity. This seems to me to be a
> > > > > relatively
> > > > > > > easy
> > > > > > > > way to reduce complexity around heat template versioning. What
> > > > > > > > do
> > > > you
> > > > > > > think?
> > > > > > > > Thanks,
> > > > > > > > Adrian
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > On Feb 29, 2016, at 8:40 AM, Hongbin Lu <hongbin.lu@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > Hi team, This is a continued discussion from a review [1].
> > > > > > > > Corey
> > > > > > O'Brien
> > > > > > > > suggested to have Magnum support a single OS distro (Atomic). I
> > > > > > > disagreed. I
> > > > > > > > think we should bring the discussion to here to get broader set
> > > > > > > > of
> > > > > > > inputs.
> > > > > > > > Corey O'Brien From the midcycle, we decided we weren't going to
> > > > > > > continue
> > > > > > > > to support 2 different versions of the k8s template. Instead,
> > > > > > > > we
> > > > were
> > > > > > > going
> > > > > > > > to maintain the Fedora Atomic version of k8s and remove the
> > > > > > > > coreos
> > > > > > > templates
> > > > > > > > from the tree. I don't think we should continue to develop
> > > > > > > > features
> > > > > for
> > > > > > > > coreos k8s if that is true. In addition, I don't think we
> > > > > > > > should
> > > > > break
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > coreos template by adding the trust token as a heat parameter.
> > > > > Hongbin
> > > > > > > Lu I
> > > > > > > > was on the midcycle and I don't remember any decision to remove
> > > > > CoreOS
> > > > > > > > support. Why you want to remove CoreOS templates from the tree.
> > > > > Please
> > > > > > > note
> > > > > > > > that this is a very big decision and please discuss it with the
> > > > team
> > > > > > > > thoughtfully and make sure everyone agree. Corey O'Brien
> > > > > > > > Removing
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > > coreos templates was a part of the COE drivers decision. Since
> > > > > > > > each
> > > > > COE
> > > > > > > > driver will only support 1 distro+version+coe we discussed
> > > > > > > > which
> > > > ones
> > > > > > to
> > > > > > > > support in tree. The decision was that instead of trying to
> > > > > > > > support
> > > > > > every
> > > > > > > > distro and every version for every coe, the magnum tree would
> > > > > > > > only
> > > > > have
> > > > > > > > support for 1 version of 1 distro for each of the 3 COEs
> > > > > > > > (swarm/docker/mesos). Since we already are going to support
> > > > > > > > Atomic
> > > > > for
> > > > > > > > swarm, removing coreos and keeping Atomic for kubernetes was
> > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > favored
> > > > > > > > choice. Hongbin Lu Strongly disagree. It is a huge risk to
> > > > > > > > support
> > > > a
> > > > > > > single
> > > > > > > > distro. The selected distro could die in the future. Who knows.
> > > > > > > > Why
> > > > > > make
> > > > > > > > Magnum take this huge risk? Again, the decision of supporting
> > > > single
> > > > > > > distro
> > > > > > > > is a very big decision. Please bring it up to the team and have
> > > > > > > > it
> > > > > > > discuss
> > > > > > > > thoughtfully before making any decision. Also, Magnum doesn't
> > > > > > > > have
> > > > to
> > > > > > > > support every distro and every version for every coe, but
> > > > > > > > should
> > > > > > support
> > > > > > > > *more than one* popular distro for some COEs (especially for
> > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > popular
> > > > > > > > COEs). Corey O'Brien The discussion at the midcycle started
> > > > > > > > from
> > > > the
> > > > > > > idea
> > > > > > > > of adding support for RHEL and CentOS. We all discussed and
> > > > > > > > decided
> > > > > > that
> > > > > > > we
> > > > > > > > wouldn't try to support everything in tree. Magnum would
> > > > > > > > provide
> > > > > > support
> > > > > > > > in-tree for 1 per COE and the COE driver interface would allow
> > > > others
> > > > > > to
> > > > > > > add
> > > > > > > > support for their preferred distro out of tree. Hongbin Lu I
> > > > agreed
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > part that "we wouldn't try to support everything in tree". That
> > > > > doesn't
> > > > > > > > imply the decision to support single distro. Again, support
> > > > > > > > single
> > > > > > distro
> > > > > > > is
> > > > > > > > a huge risk. Why make Magnum take this huge risk? [1]
> > > > > > > > https://review.openstack.org/#/c/277284/ Best regards, Hongbin
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