On 09/11/2015 12:59 PM, Adam Miller wrote: > On Fri, Sep 11, 2015 at 10:59 AM, Matthew Miller > <mattdm@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: >> On Thu, Sep 10, 2015 at 01:02:10PM -0400, Matthew Miller wrote: >>> * Vagrant boxes: >>> - same tunir-based test suite in VM environemnt >> >> Followup! Kushal points out that we are testing the KVM vagrant images >> in this way, but not testing VirtualBox. (Because we don't have >> VirtualBox in Fedora or EPEL, because out-of-tree kernel modules.). >> Like the qcow2->ec2 thing, these are the same bits as something that >> _is_ autotested, but run in a different environment. Unlike qcow2->ec2, >> we aren't even doing a boot test. >> >> >> Things which could go wrong which I see are: >> >> * some VirtualBox-specific thing with booting an updated kernel or >> grub2 (for example, updated kernel missing some drivers or something >> that VirtualBox needs) >> >> * some corruption or something in the image conversion >> >> These seem mostly unlikely, but far from impossible. >> >> >> Since VirtualBox is the format the vast majority of Vagrant users will >> want, that's... kind of a big deal. *sigh* Options I can see here are: >> >> A) Scramble to find some way to do the VirtualBox testing. >> >> B) Don't publish the VirtualBox images. >> >> C) Publish the VirtualBox images, but put them in a Penalty Box with >> extra warnings >> >> Any other ideas? Preferences? B seems the most responsible, yet also >> the most sad. A would be highly unusual for our infrastructure. C could >> expose us to looking bad if support breaks and no one notices. > > I'm pretty neutral on B or C. I don't really care and also don't think it > should even remotely be a concern of ours. Not only do we not have > testing for it but we don't even have the building blocks in place to > work towards testing it. VirtualBox is bad and those who use it should > feel bad.[0] Damn, man. That's harsh and probably not a great way to bring people into the fold. ("should feel bad" I mean. I don't disagree on the merits of VB, it's not good.) > This is probably not a popular opinion and I'm fine with that, but we > would have to install something that we very publicly speak out > against in order to test this. I'm not yet ready to throw out Fedora's > values for the sake of some OS X user's convenience but that's just > me. Which of the values would we be compromising here to test something with GPL'ed software? I realize that out of band modules aren't awesome, but I wasn't aware this was a project-level value [1]. The "some OS X user" that we're trying to reach with VirtualBox-friendly images today is a potential Fedora desktop user tomorrow. I would totally agree we shouldn't compromise by using proprietary software, but using fully GPL'ed software to test something... that doesn't seem like a violation of Fedora values to me. (Note I'm differentiating between "values" and best practices/packaging guidelines/etc. here.) [1] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Overview#Our_Core_Values -- Joe Brockmeier | Community Team, OSAS jzb@xxxxxxxxxx | http://community.redhat.com/ Twitter: @jzb | http://dissociatedpress.net/
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