On Wed, Jan 15, 2020 at 01:11:45PM -0500, Máirín Duffy wrote:
> "We envision a world where free and open source software is accessible and
> usable."
>
> What kind of long view are you going for - 10, 20, 50 years? In the past
> 10-15 years we've (the broader floss community) have already made and are
> making big strides towards this, so I don't think this really is a fresh
> inspiration. I think it could reach for more, since it's a vision
> statement.
Let's say ten years. And, okay, yes, let's reach for more!
> The other issue with this, an issue with most technological endeavors -
> it's focused on the tech, not the people. If a piece of software is usable
> and accessible in the woods, does anybody know or care?
I think that's partly what we meant with "accessible" -- if it's in the
proverbial woods where no one sees it, it is not accessible.
> I would suggest a statement here that focuses more on the world we want to
> be in (that our work will help us create) rather than just narrowly on the
> tech within it eg
>
> "We envision people around the world enjoying betterment across every area
> of life touched by technology, driven by free and open source software."
Hmmmm -- doesn't that go *more* to talking about the tech? And, also, I'm
worried that it goes too far outside the scope of what we're actually able
to impact. "Every area of life touched by technology" is... a lot.
> Or something like that. Focus on the ppl and why the software matters
> though is my main suggestion here, bc software isn't life and isn't the
> world. The accessibility and usability become a matter of course / an
> implementation detail bc if you state people are using it and it makes
> their lives better, it has to be so.
Yeah, this I understand. Thanks. :)
> "In this world, software is built by communities that are inclusive,
> welcoming, and encourage experimentation."
>
> So this hits on the project vs. community issue. The first sentence
> focused more on the project / software. This sentence, in contrast,
> focuses on the community. Is this full statement meant primarily to drive
> the project, or the management of the community, or both?
[...]
> I also understand the importance of inclusivity, being welcoming etc. but
> the way it's brought up here it comes across as a chore or a finger wag or
> a check list. Plus inclusivity, welcoming, etc are a means to an end not
> the end. You're supposed to talk abt the end in a vision statement, right?
Oh! To me, this _is_ about the end. I want a world of software that's built
by healthy collaborative communities — to me, that's a goal in itself.
("Friends" is as fundamental a value as "Features" or "Freedom".)
> I'm also not sure I agree with it. Is *all* software *only* built by
> *communities*? What is a community exactly? If it's not a company, I
> disagree because while I think open communities are great at achieving
> some things in software there are other things (like support) they're not
> too good at. You know? And I think the solution is to rephrase in a way
> that doesnt invite that line of questioning / debate bc that shouldnt be
> the point.
I think our employer shows that this doesn't have to be a dichotomy.
Software can be built by communities and companies can be participants in
those communities. There are _some_ aspects of support where a company
standing behind a product is vital, but there are other areas of support
where an active, engaged community of helpers is objectively better.
> "Diverse communities of people will participate in creation of this
> software, in an immersive culture of experimentation, collaboration, and
> sincere camaraderie."
I like some of where you're going with this, I'd like something stronger
than "participate".
> "The Fedora Project will be a reference for everyone who shares this vision."
>
> A reference is smtg you put up on a shelf to look at occasionally or to stand on to reach a jar on a top shelf. :-)
>
> "The Fedora Project aims to inspire all who share this vision."
Yes, I like it!
> Hope this is helpful
Yes, very much!
--
Matthew Miller
<mattdm@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Fedora Project Leader
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