Paul W. Frields wrote:
On Wed, 2006-08-30 at 15:47 +0530, Rahul wrote:
Paul W. Frields wrote:
Frankly, I'm a little surprised, after our previous discussions on
whether we should pursue FSF endorsement in some fashion, that we would
wring our hands much about this. We've agreed that openmotif is not
free. Fedora only ships free software. Rahul, you have said this to
many people, many times.
Yes but I have also been telling many people that we should do things in
a way that doesnt affect end users and our contributors. Pretty much
all of the openmotif dependencies in Fedora Core and Extras can be fixed
with lesstif. #3 is disruptive. #1 doesnt make much sense to me since
we havent included libraries in Fedora Core unless we had actual
applications in Fedora Core dependent on them.
I agree that #1 makes no sense.
Since there is already support to move all the openmotif dependencies
into Fedora Extras, I dont see why we need to retain openmotif in
Fedora Core.
This part I agree with. :-) I think that in this case moving the apps
and libs dependent on openmotif to Extras makes sense, which would allow
them to join the Extras "rolling release" structure.
Exactly. Does this not make sense to anyone else?
Thus, when they're
fixed, people would be able to upgrade. So you have one of two
situations AIUI, and not being a programmer type, I would appreciate
corrections where I'm wrong:
1. User has openmotif [+ dependent packages] installed, and upgrades to
FC6. The openmotif package stays installed as is, and the dependent
packages will pull in lesstif once they are rebuilt and repushed to FE.
It's up to the user to remove openmotif unless we obsolete it with
lesstif, which seems risky.
Lesstif package will automatically obsolete openmotif or install in
parallel if possible.
See https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=202527 for the
obsoletes and
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=203993 for the RFE
to make openmotif parallely installable.
2. User has openmotif [+ dependent packages] installed, and installs
FC6, expecting to find these packages again during or after
installation, and doesn't. This causes grumbling. User drops back to
FC5 until he figures out the situation by looking at release notes, FAQ,
or ML, and then chooses to either stay with FC5 until we have lesstif
replacements for his favorite packages, or he gets openmotif on his own
and takes the plunge to FC6.
FC6 has Fedora Extras repository support. So the outcome depends on
whether the user chooses to use this or not.
Neither of these situations prevents a third-party repository from
picking up openmotif if they're interested, right?
We moved GNOME 1.x libs to Fedora Extras soon after GNUCash got into
the GTK 2.x bandwagon. The current situation isnt very different.
Of course it's different. GNOME 1.x libraries are free software by
every definition that matters, while openmotif is not. Leaving
openmotif in Fedora (no matter where one puts it) and continuing to talk
about freedom is just hypocritical.
The only reason for openmotif not being dropped immediately is not break
applications and since we agreed to move openmotif dependencies to
Fedora Extras, I am arguing that we move openmotif too over till we fix
everything to work with lesstif. Everyone knows that openmotif needs to
be dropped long term. No hypocrisy there.
Rahul
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