I know, ALSA in the kernel in Linux 2.6 ! Havn't you noticed how many companies are keeping old "obsolete" versions of equipment running. It is because they are working setups and there is no good reason to mess them up. Not everyone wants to be on the bleeding edge, nor even the recently-bloody edge. I would help people who are still using Linux 2.0, because they probably have a good reason for doing so, and it is not for me to second guess them. I have two programs that will not run on anything but Linux 2.2, because they came as binaries (which is another bad situation as Linux 2.2 has problems with this new hardware). Just because I mention these reasons, this is not an invite for any of you to try to find another rational as to why I should change to Linux 2.6. (which is an attempt to keep you on the topic, see below). I was going to buy Linux 2.6, but will only put it on one machine until I discover all the new gotchas ! === I put this here because putting the topic first is not working, responders keep ignoring the topic === Topic: I suppose I am wasting my time pointing out that if ALSA had put its modules outside of "$(MODLIB)/kernel" like in "/lib/modules/2.4.31/alsa" then the kernel module install would not disturb them. It seem that modprobe should find them there, as it seems to find modules that are anywhere in all those directories. I did notice that the pcmcia modules are outside of the kernel directory. I just tried it: >> mv /lib/modules/2.4.31.W10/kernel/sound /lib/modules/2.4.31.W10/sound >> depmod Rebooted, and I still have sound. As far as I can tell all the ALSA modules load. Doing lsmod lists a bunch of ALSA modules. Again, I must point out, this is for ALSA users where it is not already part of the kernel, like on Linux 2.4. << FROM KERNEL MAKEFILE >> .PHONY: modules_install modules_install: _modinst_ $(patsubst %, _modinst_%, $(SUBDIRS)) _modinst_post .PHONY: _modinst_ _modinst_: @rm -rf $(MODLIB)/kernel <<<<<< Removes ALSA @rm -f $(MODLIB)/build @mkdir -p $(MODLIB)/kernel @ln -s $(TOPDIR) $(MODLIB)/build << END KERNEL MAKEFILE >> >From this it looks like modules_install would not touch it. === Response to Bill Unruh comments ==== > > Install of kernel modules will wipe out your ALSA driver modules, as it > cleans the entire kernel modules directory of everything. No. -- HUH, the kernel Makefile (paragraph above) shows that it will, ( @rm -rf $(MODLIB)/kernel ) -- and you said yes to the exact same thing below, which was only -- one example of why to do the sentence above. -- Perhaps you could explain beyond one word responses. > If you change a kernel config, or add a module, and reinstall your kernel > modules, you will have to reinstall ALSA again afterwards! Yes. Why not give your version of the text to put into the INSTALL file. You can start with the suggested text that you were commenting on ! I would be interested to see if I got any facts wrong, and there certainly are some things that you should know better than me. > Another tactic is to save a copy of the ALSA drivers from > "/lib/modules/2.4.31/kernel/sound" to someplace safe > (outside "/lib/modules":), > so it can be restored after kernel installs. No. You want to recompile the alsa. -- Any reason ?? As far as I know, only if you upgrade Linux or otherwise change the version numbering. -- From what I know, if the kernel version is the same, and the only thing you did was "make modules-install", then you should be able to simple copy -- the saved ALSA modules back to where they belong. This is the situation when you have to add a kernel module for a new hardware. -- I think that moving the ALSA modules outside of kernel module space is better, assuming that does not have any gotchas itself. -- For now I would keep a backup copy too. -- The above discussion is for those who install ALSA modules as a package outside the Linux kernel. === Your expectations do not equal my expectations, and probably very few others expectations === And this has nothing to do with you personally, just in case you want to go off on that tangent. It is true for everybody. Each persons experience with Linux is different, and likely very different than any of the people on the ALSA dev team. That is why we have to be explicit with pointing out things that you might consider so obvious, even including docs for people still using "obsolete" versions of Linux. I tend to forget these gotchas after a couple years of running a system because I have alot of other things to do every day, which is why it is so important -- to get them written down -- .. I would expect a package to install things where they do not get wiped out accidently. From experience, packages to do not step on each others files. I expected ALSA to install its kernel modules where the kernel would not wipe them out. I had no reason to suspect it was going to interact with kernel installs, it did not warn that it would. This is the only package I have ever encountered that behaved this way. Any other experience that YOU may have had does not help because I cannot read your mind. (Can you write it down, perhaps). I am trying to save other people from these gotchas by putting a few paragraphs in the INSTALL file. Personal responses to me are pointless to that goal of saving other people from the hassle that I went though. I thought it was worth my time to try to get some paragraphs in the INSTALL file to help other users that could get caught by this. I do not care if it is only 5 or 10 other people, I consider it worth my time to help them avoid this gotcha! Maybe you can figure out what happened, but it is unreasonable to expect that of the general user. One person having a problem and letting you know about it, is an indicator that there are probably 100 having the same problem and giving up. Getting personal about the one person who lets you know about the problem does not solve anything for the 100 others. Every response I get it is chopped up with little comments on my email, my expectations, my obsolete Linux, and considerations that the ALSA home page and INSTALL could be improved are ignored. I could suppose that I am not actually talking to anyone who could make decisions on the INSTALL file or the home page. What is it with NOT WANTING to let people know about some gotchas ! Its only a few paragraphs in the INSTALL file, and only a few lines in your home page. Wesley Johnson, Linux user since 1994 --- Get FREE High Speed Internet from USFamily.Net! -- http://www.usfamily.net/mkt-freepromo.html --- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move Developer's challenge Build the coolest Linux based applications with Moblin SDK & win great prizes Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open Source event anywhere in the world http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100&url=/ _______________________________________________ Alsa-user mailing list Alsa-user@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/alsa-user
