Ronan, I have no experience with those sound oriented distros except a brief stay with Planet CCRMA. My experience with CCRMA led me to believe that those distros are excellent if that is all you need. But if you need other things on your pc because you also use it for more general purpose work (photo, editing) then I ran into trouble. So I started with a general purpose distro and worked until audio ran as good as I need it. But from your description, you need far more than I do. More between the lines... On Wednesday 24 January 2007 00:43, ronan mcallister wrote: > Johan, > > Thanks for your continued thoughts on this. > > Now that I've broken my Suse 10.1 boot (tried a kernel update - no good) -- > I have an option of installing any one of the music distros, eg Studio64 (I > haev a pentium D proessor) -- or others like gentoo you have mentioned. > But Gentoo's installer doesn't recognise my SATA drives. I only installed Gentoo once with sata disks (this pc) and I had no problem. Did you read/searched the forums? This might give a clue: http://gentoo-wiki.com/HARDWARE_SATA > > I'm writing to ask about Studio64 and the other distros relative to what you > have said and considering my needs: I am not a musician, although I'd like > to keep music generation, recording and mastering in mind -- rather I intend > to use Linux as a digital solution in prosound and high-end home hi-fi > applications, replacing commercial product$ with better and more flexible > software. > > The Studio64 "readme" warns that upon installation, the existing partitions > may get over-written. Most of these distros warn about that -- I've got my > XP production OS on my first SATA drive, and when I had Suse 10.1 working it > installed flawlessly on my second (fresh) SATA drive dual bootable vis > Grub. > > From your experience, in terms of installation robustness and maturity, > would you pick one or the other of these distros over the other? I do not have experience with studio64, but Dave Phillips has good words about it. Read: http://www.linuxjournal.com/node/1000171 Regarding maturity I guess Suse is more mature than Studio64 since the latter is still in development. Suse has always been a stable distro, but I left it because I struggled with audio on it. Mind you, I didn't had much experience then. > > Will Studio 64's install overwrite my partitions or is this just a warning? No idea! If you want to be sure, remove your working OS drive before you start or clone it. > > Are any of these distros any better with managing and processing "live" > sound (not a Live CD -- but an Installed Linux) ? EG, I want to > signal-process live audio as in live concerts as well as use something like > bruteFIR for home-hifi and home theater (eg to implement digital crossovers, > filters, acoustic analysis, etc). Most of the folks I've discussed this > with use Linux audio tools for creating/modifying/mastering studio music not > "live" sound. Never tried to do live sound with it. I'm one of the recording/messing around types :) > > Thank you again, > Ronan > Regards, Johan > > On 1/19/07, Johan De Groote <johan.de.groote@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: > > > > On Friday 19 January 2007 16:28, ronan mcallister wrote: > > > Hi Klangmeister, > > > > > > Thanks for the advice, sorry for the *long* reply. > > > > > > What Linux/distro do you use? > > > > Using Gentoo with an DIGI5296 and ADI-8 AE. The DIGI96/8 is in another pc > > at > > the moment. No problems unless running "emerge --rsync" while recording. > > > > > > > > Since I posted this I've been experiencing "..But you'll pay dearly > > > for it" with an issue I have on Suse 10.1 and my inbuilt Intel 82801G > > > ICH7 multichannel sound card. My hope was to install and run up Linux > > > and test the inbuilt audio software, but I can't seem to get even the > > > most basic features to work -- I've posted elsewhere, but this group > > > seems to be the most active. I think the problem is not Alsa but Jack > > > as I can playback wav's and capture audio through Alsa (eg aplay, > > > amarok), but anything I playback through Jack connections (Ardour etc) > > > is distorted - noisy - clicky and no answer found yet. I'm not sure > > > how to troubleshoot Jack. > > > > > > Do you know of a better forum to ask about how to troubleshoot Jack? > > > I suppose installing a 9632 would add to my woes rather than cure > > > them. > > > > > > Nevertheless, I will probably try to get this resolved before I invest > > > in an RME. At least I need to understand Jack as I'm sure I'll need > > > it. One issue I have with the RME is that my media center PC only has > > > one PCI slot. I'll need to pull out some other capability or find a > > > PCI extension bay... > > > > > > >You need one input channel per speaker and apparently three outputs. > > > >While I personally think that that is overkill (why not make a good > > > >analog crossover), that's what you'd have to do. So for a 5.1 system > > > >you'd need 16 channels (3x5 for 5 surround channels plus 1 for the > > > >sub). > > > > You can make the analog x-over as good as you want but you will never be > > able > > to correct for phase and delay. A digital x-over an do this when you > > implement a filter followed by a phase corrector. But before this becomes > > something that you can actually hear you have to spend far more time and > > money on your room than any normal person does. If you have the luxury of > > a > > separate acousticaly optimised listening room it starts to makes sense. > > > > > > > > Overkill? perhaps... probably! Ultimately I will implement > > > auto-room-eq, loudspeaker management, and sub-bass enhancement with my > > > crossovers. This for home theater/audio as well as the biggest > > > challenge: prosound, wherein the flexibility digital offers in these > > > areas is attractive. Yes, we can purchase DBX and other loudspeaker > > > "do it all's" (EQ, xover's, delay/compression/limiting) and at some > > > point I may decide the time invested in implementing this in Linux via > > > "effortware" isn't worth the trouble (my time is worth something I > > > keep saying...). > > > > I bought the RME for the same reasons as you (x-over, phase and delay > > correction) but decided that my time _is_ worth something to me. So I > > dropped > > it. The advantage of the RME cards is that you have a lot of IO on a > > single > > card, and that you can add cards without problems later. > > > > > > > > BTW have been looking at other signal processing products like Signal > > > Wizard (DSP without tears) and an exciting analog product > > > "SonicMaster" by Anadigm (www.anadigm.com) but alas these both so far > > > fall short in terms of our long-term goals. The closest thing I've > > > seen is the low-cost DBX unit (driverack pro) which does pretty much > > > everything but clean your dishes however this won't work in all > > > situations. > > > > > > Am I right in that the 9632 with external IO cards would prevent the > > > need for external AD/DA? not sure I'm prepared for the cost of all > > > the non-analog RME solution apparently requires. > > > > In a way they are external AD/DA, only they sit inside our pc. I would not > > go > > for the RME internal IO cards as they will take a lot of space in the pc, > > and > > I would prefer the pc away from the audio and go digital to the setup. > > Perfect situation for RME gear. Any AD/DA convertor that has ADAT > > interface > > is usable. I use both a RME ADI and a Fostex VC-8. It will cost, but what > > you > > want will cost whatever way you build it. > > > > > > > > >From what I can tell, the RME has about the best LF response (among > > > other things) -- my infrasonic processing will need to go down to 8Hz > > > and the RME appears to be good to 5Hz. Yup, we will be using some > > > sort of long-throw woofers with low efficiency and lots of power for > > > 8-80Hz sub-bass. > > > > The RME is digital, so it could go to DC. But the DA convertors will be > > your > > limit. I don't see what usefull info there is at 5 Hz, but that is your > > problem I guess. > > > > Enjoy, > > Johan > > > > > > > > Thanks alot, > > > Ronan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 1/19/07, Roman Katzer <klangmeister@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > > > > Hi Ronan, > > > > > > > > first, RME Firewire devices are not supported (yet) AFAIK. > > > > > > > > On 16/01/07, ronan mcallister <bass.woofer@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: > > > > > I'm writing to ask about the RME cards relatively to Linux (I'm > > using > > > > > Suse 10.1) -- which RME cards are the most fully-featured to work > > with > > > > > ALSA in the various product lines? Which cards within those most > > > > > actively "supported" by the driver developers are the most robust > > and > > > > > the best cost/feature wise? Which have the most flexibilty? > > > > > > > > The flexibility part depends on your needs. I use a bunch of > > > > Multifaces (>15) and Digifaces (>8) on a number of machines (>24), as > > > > well as three MADI systems and one HDSP9652. The MADI systems have the > > > > highest number of I/O channels. The HDSP 9652 is like a built-in > > > > Digiface. If you need that many channels, you would have to get a > > > > Digiface and some ADI-8 AD/DAs. ADI-8 are high quality units that > > > > convert ADAT to analog and vice versa, at a pretty high price. > > > > I also tried using Alesis units that also do analog to ADAT > > > > conversion, but all odd channels have a 1.3 sample latency with > > > > respect to the even channels, so they're unusable to me. > > > > > > > > > The 9632 can handle supposedly 6 I/O simultaneously. > > > > > Is my assumption I'd need one output card for use to implement a 2X6 > > > > > analog I/O correct? > > > > > > > > You need one input channel per speaker and apparently three outputs. > > > > While I personally think that that is overkill (why not make a good > > > > analog crossover), that's what you'd have to do. So for a 5.1 system > > > > you'd need 16 channels (3x5 for 5 surround channels plus 1 for the > > > > sub). > > > > > > > > > Which of the RME cards are most actively used/supported? > > > > > > > > Support is good for all PCI-based cards. Keep your mitts off the > > > > Firewire units. > > > > > > > > > Are there any other sound cards with similar characteristics that > > > > > might be a better choice? > > > > > > > > I don't know of any that are that good. For that reason I (well, my > > > > company) uses RME. > > > > > > > > > I can buy dedicated prosound or > > > > > home hifi equipment (loudspeaker management system) to do the same > > for > > > > > less money -- yet I'd rather implement in something like BruteFIR > > and > > > > > Linux if I can avoid commercial equipment. > > > > > > > > Not to mention the flexibility you'll get. But you'll pay dearly for > > it. > > > > > > > > > Oh and one problem with the RME card is if I need onboard I/O cards, > > > > > it will take up more PCI slots than I have (I only have one spare > > PCE > > > > > card). I'd have to find a PCI extender etc. I wonder if I should > > > > > look at a fully outboard firewire device? > > > > > > > > RME HDSP 9652 takes one PCI slot and one additional slot cover without > > > > occupying the actual slot. Plus external AD/DAs. > > > > > > > > HTH, RoMan > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > Take Surveys. Earn Cash. 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