For IE, you also want to add the META tags for HTTP-EQUIV for you charset. In some circumstances, with "mixed" charsets on a page, and with IE in quirks mode, IE will try to "guess" the charset and get it (very) wrong. You really do want a DOCTYPE and a document that validates if at all possible. It makes all the difference in the world to the browser treating your lovely UTF-8 document as UTF-8 or html-soup and doing whatever it wants since you obviously don't know what you are doing. :-) Certainly if you save it as ASCII and convert the UTF-8 into ASCII not-really-equivalent, and then try to display it, you'll get sub-optimal results. Only way to use UTF-8 is to have UTF-8 used consistently through the whole chain. HTTP form requests. MySQL client MySQL server HTTP output. -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php