Hi everyone, there's the following example in the docs about hot backups: > touch /var/lib/pgsql/backup_in_progress > psql -c "select pg_start_backup('hot_backup');" > tar -cf /var/lib/pgsql/backup.tar /var/lib/pgsql/data/ > psql -c "select pg_stop_backup();" > rm /var/lib/pgsql/backup_in_progress > tar -rf /var/lib/pgsql/backup.tar /var/lib/pgsql/archive/ https://www.postgresql.org/docs/11/continuous-archiving.html#BACKUP-TIPS These are the important things to keep in mind from my understanding: 1. The data directory of Postgres is designed to be crash safe[1] and unless files are forcefully deleted or otherwise damaged, PG should recover from a crash. It does so with the help of its WAL files, so those define to which point PG recovers, which data is actually available, which state databases have in the end etc. 2. Copying the data directory might take a long time, during which PG is free to write to any file. Though, "pg_start_backup" guarantees crash safety again by creating a CHECKPOINT[2] for the data directory and additional WALs are used to record any changes during copying. "pg_stop_backup" tells about the last WAL necessary to replay all changes during the backup, regardless of how the data dir changed at the same time. Things are based on crash safety of "pg_start_backup". When having atomic file system snapshots available, the advice is to simply use those[1], because PG has crash safety. State is frozen this way and when actually copying files, changes during how long the copy takes are NOT taken into account anymore because of the snapshot. Without those snapshots pg_start_backup+copy+pg_stop_backup+WAL is suggested instead[1]. WAL-archiving assures that all changes during the copy up until the logical end of the backup issued by executing "pg_stop_backup" are available. But what if I'm not interested in the changes during copying the data directory? This is exactly the same use case like when using file system snapshots, for which I don't get changes during the backup process itself as well. So a process of "pg_start_backup", directly followed by a "pg_stop_backup" with assuring that the WALs during both calls are preserved, should result in a valid backup, shouldn't it? An afterwards copied data directory is crash safe again up to the point "pg_start_backup" has been called and can recover using the WALs up to the point "pg_stop_backup" has been called. Regardless how long copying the data directory takes and which changes Postgres applies. Those changes are simply discarded during recovery, aren't they? So one might lose changes during the backup process by not following the order of the docs, but again, I might not care, like with file system snapshots. Or what's the difference when looking at consistency/recovery compared to some point in time only between FS level snapshots and using pg_start|stop_backup+WALs in different order? >From my understanding, pg_start_backup+pg_stop_backup+FS-snapshot should even be the most correct approach, as long as the created WALs are contained in the snapshot. Other thoughts? Thanks! [1]: https://dba.stackexchange.com/a/44262/99683 [2]: https://www.postgresql.org/docs/11/continuous-archiving.html#BACKUP-LOWLEVEL-BASE-BACKUP Mit freundlichen Grüßen Thorsten Schöning -- AM-SoFT IT-Service - Bitstore Hameln GmbH Mitglied der Bitstore Gruppe - Ihr Full-Service-Dienstleister für IT und TK E-Mail: Thorsten.Schoening@xxxxxxxxxx Web: http://www.AM-SoFT.de/ Tel: 05151- 9468- 0 Tel: 05151- 9468-55 Fax: 05151- 9468-88 Mobil: 0178-8 9468-04 AM-SoFT IT-Service - Bitstore Hameln GmbH, Brandenburger Str. 7c, 31789 Hameln AG Hannover HRB 221853 - Geschäftsführer: Janine Galonska Für Rückfragen stehe ich Ihnen sehr gerne zur Verfügung. Mit freundlichen Grüßen Thorsten Schöning Tel: 05151 9468 0 Fax: 05151 9468 88 Mobil: Webseite: https://www.am-soft.de AM-Soft IT-Service - Bitstore Hameln GmbH i.G. ist ein Mitglied der Bitstore Gruppe - Ihr Full-Service-Dienstleister für IT und TK AM-Soft IT-Service - Bitstore Hameln GmbH i.G. 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