On Tue, Jan 15, 2019 at 09:21:32AM +1100, Dave Chinner wrote: > On Mon, Jan 14, 2019 at 01:35:57PM -0800, Dan Williams wrote: > > On Mon, Jan 14, 2019 at 1:25 PM Dave Chinner <david@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > > > > > > On Mon, Jan 14, 2019 at 02:15:40AM -0500, Pankaj Gupta wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Until you have images (and hence host page cache) shared between > > > > > > multiple guests. People will want to do this, because it means they > > > > > > only need a single set of pages in host memory for executable > > > > > > binaries rather than a set of pages per guest. Then you have > > > > > > multiple guests being able to detect residency of the same set of > > > > > > pages. If the guests can then, in any way, control eviction of the > > > > > > pages from the host cache, then we have a guest-to-guest information > > > > > > leak channel. > > > > > > > > > > I don't think we should ever be considering something that would allow a > > > > > guest to evict page's from the host's pagecache [1]. The guest should > > > > > be able to kick its own references to the host's pagecache out of its > > > > > own pagecache, but not be able to influence whether the host or another > > > > > guest has a read-only mapping cached. > > > > > > > > > > [1] Unless the guest is allowed to modify the host's file; obviously > > > > > truncation, holepunching, etc are going to evict pages from the host's > > > > > page cache. > > > > > > > > This is so correct. Guest does not not evict host page cache pages directly. > > > > > > They don't right now. > > > > > > But someone is going to end up asking for discard to work so that > > > the guest can free unused space in the underlying spares image (i.e. > > > make use of fstrim or mount -o discard) because they have workloads > > > that have bursts of space usage and they need to trim the image > > > files afterwards to keep their overall space usage under control. > > > > > > And then.... > > > > ...we reject / push back on that patch citing the above concern. > > So at what point do we draw the line? > > We're allowing writable DAX mappings, but as I've pointed out that > means we are going to be allowing a potential information leak via > files with shared extents to be directly mapped and written to. > > But we won't allow useful admin operations that allow better > management of host side storage space similar to how normal image > files are used by guests because it's an information leak vector? > > That's splitting some really fine hairs there... May I summarize that th security implications need to be documented? In fact that would make a fine security implications section in the device specification. > > > > In case of virtio-pmem & DAX, guest clears guest page cache exceptional entries. > > > > Its solely decision of host to take action on the host page cache pages. > > > > > > > > In case of virtio-pmem, guest does not modify host file directly i.e don't > > > > perform hole punch & truncation operation directly on host file. > > > > > > ... this will no longer be true, and the nuclear landmine in this > > > driver interface will have been armed.... > > > > I agree with the need to be careful when / if explicit cache control > > is added, but that's not the case today. > > "if"? > > I expect it to be "when", not if. Expect the worst, plan for it now. > > Cheers, > > Dave. > -- > Dave Chinner > david@xxxxxxxxxxxxx _______________________________________________ Virtualization mailing list Virtualization@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/virtualization
