On Wed, May 19, 2021 at 1:20 PM Jonathan Cameron
<Jonathan.Cameron@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> On Wed, 19 May 2021 12:20:17 -0700
> Dan Williams <dan.j.williams@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> > On Wed, May 19, 2021 at 10:03 AM Jonathan Cameron
> > <Jonathan.Cameron@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > [..]
> > > > > "The DOE Busy bit can be used to indicate that the DOE responder is
> > > > > temporarily unable to accept a data object. It is necessary for a
> > > > > DOE requester to ensure that individual data object transfers are
> > > > > completed, and that a request/response contract is completed, for
> > > > > example using a mutex mechanism to block other conflicting traffic
> > > > > for cases where such conflicts are possible."
> > > >
> > > > I read that as the specification mandating my proposal to disallow
> > > > multi-initiator access. My only mistake was making the exclusion apply
> > > > to reads and not limiting it to the minimum of config write exclusion.
> > >
> > > Key thing is even that isn't enough. The mutex isn't about stopping
> > > temporary access, it's about ensuring "request/response contract is completed".
> > > So you would need userspace to be able to take a lock to stop the kernel
> > > from using the DOE whilst it completes it's request/response pair and
> > > userspace to guarantee it doesn't do anything stupid.
> >
> > A userspace lockout of the kernel is not needed if userspace is
> > outright forbidden from corrupting the kernel's state machine. I.e.
> > kernel enforced full disable of user initiated config-write to DOE
> > registers, not the ephemeral pci_cfg_access_lock() proposal.
>
> That would work but I thought was ruled out as an approach.
> @Bjorn would this be acceptable?
>
It sounded like Bjorn needed more convincing:
"I don't know how hard we should work to protect against that."
...and I'm advocating that yes, DOE config-writes are in a different
class than other critical register writes, and that class is analogous
to what Linux does for driver managed MMIO exclusion.
> >
> > > Easiest way to do that is provide proper interfaces that allows the
> > > kernel to fully mediate the access + don't support direct userspace access
> > > for normal operation. (treat it the same as an other config space write)
> >
> > Again, it's the parenthetical at issue. I struggle to see this as just
> > another errant / unwanted config-write when there is legitimate reason
> > for userspace to expect that touching the DOE is not destructive to
> > device operation as opposed to writes to other critical registers.
>
> True for specific protocols (CDAT). I'm fairly sure, with IDE you can take down
> the link encryption to the device, potentially (worst case?) resulting a memory
> access failure and a machine reboot or corruption of persistent memory.
No, that does not sound right. My reading of the PCI IDE spec
highlights a few exclusions that apply here:
1/ A DOE instance that implements the CMA/SPDM protocol will support
"no other data object protocol(s)".
2/ An SPDM session once established arranges for "requests that are
received through a different secure [SPDM] session must be discarded
by the Responder, and must not result in a response"
>
> > Where the kernel's legitimate-access and userspace's legitimate-access
> > to a resource collide, the kernel provides a mediation interface that
> > precludes conflicts. Otherwise, I don't understand why the kernel is
> > going through the trouble of /dev/mem and pci-mmap restrictions if it
> > is not supposed to be concerned about userspace corrupting driver
> > state.
>
> The short answer is that lock requirement, in the above note, rules
> out safe direct userspace use of the DOE (unless we can tell the kernel
> is not going to ever use it).
Linux has the mitigation for that situation defined already. It's the
mechanism for /dev/mem and pci-mmap exclusion: disable the driver to
enable unfettered userspace access (modulo kernel-lockdown is
disabled).
> Mediation must be done. Even if we safely
> protect the kernel side via aborts, userspace transactions can be
> interrupted in a fashion that is invisible to userspace (beyond maybe
> a timeout if the userspace code is hardened against this).
Right, ephemeral per-transaction lockout is more complicated to handle
than coarse lockout bounded to driver attach lifetime.
> So there is no
> legitimate use that is not fully mediated by the kernel. So ioctl
> or defined per protocol interfaces are the way forwards.
Agree, and Linux has historically tried to wrap specific protocols
around capabilities like this rather than defining raw passthroughs.
I.e. I'm equating DOE enabling policy to ACPI DSM enabling policy. So
per-protocol enabling is my expectation regardless of sysfs or ioctl.
In fact. for SPDM and IDE key establishment that is probably neither
ioctl nor sysfs, but instead a cooperation with the Linux keys api.
> Perhaps that's putting it rather strongly :)
No major disagreement on the big picture... just quibbling with
details at this point.
