On 02/10/2010 11:06 AM, Michael Evans wrote: > On Wed, Feb 10, 2010 at 7:49 AM, Dan Williams <dan.j.williams@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: >> On Tue, Feb 9, 2010 at 6:33 PM, Neil Brown <neilb@xxxxxxx> wrote: >>> On Tue, 9 Feb 2010 15:58:52 -0900 (AKST) >>> "Mr. James W. Laferriere" <babydr@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: >>>> >>>> But that said , the idea of a /'name' area for this is imo a very good >>>> thing . Rather hiding it below others . >>> >>> Thanks. >>> >>> One idea that has occurred to me is that maybe /sys is the right place to put >>> this stuff!!! If only sysfs directories could be writeable, I could write the >>> pid file in /sys/class/block/md0/md/mdmon.pid and create a socket with a >>> similar name. >> >> Hmm... we already have /sys/kernel/debug as a simple mount point for >> debugfs. What about adding /sys/kernel/init as a mount point for this >> tmpfs? >> >> -- >> Dan >> -- >> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-raid" in >> the body of a message to majordomo@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx >> More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html >> > > Except that isn't quite accurate is it? This is less to do with init > for the kernel and more to do with various pieces of system state > information. > > /sys/early_rw > > Isn't very descriptive, but might make sense. It also might not quite > be what we want to mean, as the files in it could also linger past > root unmount as the system is brought down. Well, *no* name really fits well so far. The fact of the matter is that we are talking about lots of different types of files, and different lifetimes for those files. Eg: dhcp lease file, only needs to be there until moved after root mounted; mdmon.sock file, can't be moved, but when mdmon is restart will get new file in proper location (unless we use this location on restart too in order to avoid shutdown issues, although I'm not convinced we need to do this, seems to me we could just as easily switch to using remount ro as the norm instead of umount and problem solved); mdmon.pid file so we know what processes to restart; other files too that I'm not so familiar with. The only thing all these files have in common is that they violate a core tenet of unix philosophy/prior art. Specifically, the concept of everything as a file in unix means that the unix kernel is not really functional without a filesystem. Hence why unix never booted into a basic interpreter without a disk, but instead always panicked. But, in the past, old time unix kernels always brought up the root filesystem before doing anything else. That is no longer true, and we are struggling to access our root filesystem to create files when the real root filesystem does not yet exist. That is the one thing all of these files have in common. That they are being created before the kernel is ready to deal with files properly. So since this is specifically a kernel not ready thing, I think /sys/kernel makes sense. Then I would suggest naming whatever we put in there according to this one common trait. I could see /sys/kernel/pre-init-tmp (or ptmp for short). If someone wanted to do some neat kernel programming maybe we could make /sys/kernel/early-root and allow programs to create files in there as well as directory hiearchies, and maybe add a syscall that would actually move all the files in here to the real root sometime after pivot root and read write bring up are complete (that would just be cool...no manually moving files, just bring root up r/w, clean out /var/run and any other cleanups we do before proceeding, then do this syscall and get things moved from early-root to the real root). Anyway, my $.02. -- Doug Ledford <dledford@xxxxxxxxxx> GPG KeyID: CFBFF194 http://people.redhat.com/dledford Infiniband specific RPMs available at http://people.redhat.com/dledford/Infiniband
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