On Wed, Jul 07, 2021 at 12:18:45PM -0400, Jeff Layton wrote:
> On Wed, 2021-07-07 at 17:46 +0200, Greg KH wrote:
> > On Wed, Jul 07, 2021 at 11:34:17AM -0400, J. Bruce Fields wrote:
> > > On Wed, Jul 07, 2021 at 05:31:06PM +0200, Greg KH wrote:
> > > > On Wed, Jul 07, 2021 at 11:19:36AM -0400, J. Bruce Fields wrote:
> > > > > On Wed, Jul 07, 2021 at 05:06:45PM +0200, Greg KH wrote:
> > > > > > On Wed, Jul 07, 2021 at 09:51:29AM -0400, J. Bruce Fields wrote:
> > > > > > > On Wed, Jul 07, 2021 at 07:40:47AM -0400, Jeff Layton wrote:
> > > > > > > > On Wed, 2021-07-07 at 12:51 +0200, Greg KH wrote:
> > > > > > > > > On Wed, Jul 07, 2021 at 06:44:42AM -0400, Jeff Layton wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > On Wed, 2021-07-07 at 08:05 +0200, Greg KH wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Jul 07, 2021 at 10:35:47AM +0800, Desmond Cheong Zhi Xi wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > + WARN_ON_ONCE(irqs_disabled());
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > If this triggers, you just rebooted the box :(
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Please never do this, either properly handle the problem and return an
> > > > > > > > > > > error, or do not check for this. It is not any type of "fix" at all,
> > > > > > > > > > > and at most, a debugging aid while you work on the root problem.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > thanks,
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > greg k-h
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Wait, what? Why would testing for irqs being disabled and throwing a
> > > > > > > > > > WARN_ON in that case crash the box?
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > If panic-on-warn is enabled, which is a common setting for systems these
> > > > > > > > > days.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Ok, that makes some sense.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Wait, I don't get it.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > How are we supposed to decide when to use WARN, when to use BUG, and
> > > > > > > when to panic? Do we really want to treat them all as equivalent? And
> > > > > > > who exactly is turning on panic-on-warn?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > You never use WARN or BUG, unless the system is so messed up that you
> > > > > > can not possibly recover from the issue.
> > > > >
> > > > > I've heard similar advice for BUG before, but this is the first I've
> > > > > heard it for WARN. Do we have any guidelines for how to choose between
> > > > > WARN and BUG?
> > > >
> > > > Never use either :)
> > >
> > > I can't tell if you're kidding.
> >
> > I am not.
> >
> > > Is there some plan to remove them?
> >
> > Over time, yes. And any WARN that userspace can ever hit should be
> > removed today.
> >
> > > There are definitely cases where I've been able to resolve a problem
> > > more quickly because I got a backtrace from a WARN.
> >
> > If you want a backtrace, ask for that, recover from the error, and move
> > on. Do not allow userspace to reboot a machine for no good reason as
> > again, panic-on-warn is a common setting that people use now.
> >
> > This is what all of the syzbot work has been doing, it triggers things
> > that cause WARN() to be hit and so we have to fix them.
> >
>
> This seems really draconian. Clearly we do want to fix things that show
> a WARN (otherwise we wouldn't bother warning about it), but I don't
> think that's a reason to completely avoid them. My understanding has
> always been:
>
> BUG: for when you reach some condition where the kernel (probably) can't
> carry on
>
> WARN: for when you reach some condition that is problematic but where
> the machine can probably soldier on.
>
> Over the last several years, I've changed a lot of BUGs into WARNs to
> avoid crashing the box unnecessarily. If someone is setting
> panic_on_warn, then aren't they just getting what they asked for?
>
> While I don't feel that strongly about this particular WARN in this
> patch, it seems like a reasonable thing to do. If someone calls these
> functions with IRQs disabled, then they might end up with some subtle
> problems that could be hard to detect otherwise.
Don't we already have a debugging option that would catch this?
config DEBUG_IRQFLAGS
bool "Debug IRQ flag manipulation"
help
Enables checks for potentially unsafe enabling or disabling of
interrupts, such as calling raw_local_irq_restore() when interrupts
are enabled.
so I think this particular warn is unnecessary.
But I also disagree with Greg. Normal users aren't setting panic-on-warn.
Various build bots are setting panic-on-warn -- and they should -- because
we shouldn't be able to trigger these kinds of warnings from userspace.
Those are bugs that should be fixed. But there's no reason to shy away
from using a WARN when it's the right thing to do.
