On Thu, Jul 22, 2010 at 12:06 PM, Greg Freemyer <greg.freemyer@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: > On Thu, Jul 22, 2010 at 11:47 AM, Linus Torvalds > <torvalds@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: >> On Thu, Jul 22, 2010 at 8:36 AM, Volker Lendecke >> <Volker.Lendecke@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: >>> >>> The nice thing about this is also that if this is supposed >>> to be fully usable for Windows clients, the birthtime needs >>> to be changeable. That's what NTFS semantics gives you, thus >>> Windows clients tend to require it. >> >> Ok. So it's not really a creation date, exactly the same way ctime >> isn't at all a creation date. >> >> And maybe that actually hints at a better solution: maybe a better >> model is to create a new per-thread flag that says "do ctime updates >> the way windows does them". >> >> So instead of adding another "btime" - which isn't actually what even >> windows does - just admit that the _real_ issue is that Unix and >> Windows semantics are different for the pre-existing "ctime". >> >> The fact is, windows has "access time", "modification time" and >> "creation time" _exactly_ like UNIX. It's just that the ctime has >> slightly different semantics in windows vs unix. So quite frankly, >> it's totally insane to introduce a "birthtime", when that isn't even >> what windows wants, just because people cannot face the actual real >> difference. >> >> Tell me why we shouldn't just do this right? >> >> Linus > > I haven't been keeping up with this thread, but I believe NTFS has a > number of timestamps, not just 3. > > This blog post references 8 in the left hand column. > > The 4 standard (most common) ones are: > > File last access > File last modified > File created > MFT last modified > > My understanding is that "MFT last modified" has semantics very > similar to Linux ctime. > > But there is not a generic equivalent to NTFS created. > > Thus if trying to have the Linux kernel match NTFS semantics for the > benefit of Samba is the goal, it seems a new field should be preferred > instead of having linux ctime try to do different jobs. > > Greg I forgot the blog post url: http://blogs.sans.org/computer-forensics/2010/04/12/windows-7-mft-entry-timestamp-properties/ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-cifs" in the body of a message to majordomo@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
