On Sun March 12 2006 03:56, Loki Davison wrote: > Some people don't think right for lisp based language. There > are actually people out there that like j2ee, asp, etc and > enjoy writing huge amount of code to do very little. I actually prefer perl, and have started a couple times to try to come up with a perl module for composition. My perl chops aren't good enough to write such a thing, though, and perl's object syntax is so clumsy that it probably would have sucked anyway. For code that I and others are going to have to look at in 6 months or more, yes, I do prefer things like BASIC. Gambas is my current favorite for desktop development and I'm slowly moving from Perl to PHP for web development. (I gave up on Java for anything client-side back when the Microsoft JVM was heavily deployed and ruined everything.) But I haven't tried to write any music programs in Gambas or PHP, much less try to come up with a way to compose music in them directly. They're both probably too wordy for the expressiveness required in a music language, but I'd say the same of Python too. Anyway, the kind of people who tend to successfully write music languages tend to be CS people who just love the simplicity (to a CS major) of Lisp, so I'm resigned to sticking with applications, and as I said in my original post, they just aren't the answer for any composer who's not a programmer and many who are. Rob