On Wed, Dec 15, 2021 at 3:16 PM Peter Zijlstra <peterz@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> On Wed, Dec 15, 2021 at 01:04:33PM -0800, Peter Oskolkov wrote:
> > On Wed, Dec 15, 2021 at 10:25 AM Peter Zijlstra <peterz@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > >
> > > On Wed, Dec 15, 2021 at 09:56:06AM -0800, Peter Oskolkov wrote:
> > > > On Wed, Dec 15, 2021 at 2:06 AM Peter Zijlstra <peterz@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > > > > /*
> > > > > + * Enqueue tsk to it's server's runnable list and wake the server for pickup if
> > > > > + * so desired. Notable LAZY workers will not wake the server and rely on the
> > > > > + * server to do pickup whenever it naturally runs next.
> > > >
> > > > No, I never suggested we needed per-server runnable queues: in all my
> > > > patchsets I had a single list of idle (runnable) workers.
> > >
> > > This is not about the idle servers..
> > >
> > > So without the LAZY thing on, a previously blocked task hitting sys_exit
> > > will enqueue itself on the runnable list and wake the server for pickup.
> >
> > How can a blocked task hit sys_exit()? Shouldn't it be RUNNING?
>
> Task was RUNNING, hits schedule() after passing through sys_enter().
> this marks it BLOCKED. Task wakes again and proceeds to sys_exit(), at
> which point it's marked RUNNABLE and put on the runnable list. After
> which it'll kick the server to process said list.
>
Ah, you are talking about sys_exit hook; sorry, I thought you talked
about the exit() syscall.
[...]
>
> Well, that's *your* use-case. I'm fairly sure there's more people that
> want to use this thing.
>
> > multiple
> > priorities and work isolation: these are easy to address directly with
> > a scheduler that has a global view rather than multiple
> > per-cpu/per-server schedulers/queues that try to coordinate.
>
> You can trivially create this, even if the underlying thing is
> per-server. Simply have a lock and shared data structure between the
> servers.
>
> Even in the kernel, it should be mostly trivial to create a global
> policy. The only tricky bit (in the kernel) is the whole affinity muck,
> but userspace doesn't *need* to do even that.
>
> > > LAZY enables that.. *however* it does need to wake the server when it is
> > > idle, otherwise they'll all sit there waiting for one another.
> >
> > If all servers are busy running workers, then it is not up to the
> > kernel to "preempt" them in my model: the userspace can set up another
> > thread/task to preempt a misbehaving worker, which will wake the
> > server attached to it.
>
> So the way I'm seeing things is that the server *is* the 'CPU'. A UP
> machine cannot rely on another CPU to make preemption happen.
>
> Also, preemption is very much not about misbehaviour. Wakeup can cause a
> preemption event if the woken task is deemed higher priority than the
> current running one for example.
>
> And time based preemption is definitely also a thing wrt resource
> distribution.
>
> > But in practice there are always workers
> > blocking in the kernel, which wakes their servers, which then reap the
> > woken/runnable workers list, so well-behaving code does not need this.
>
> This seems to discount pure computational workloads.
>
> > And so we need to figure out this high-level thing first: do we go
> > with the per-server worker queues/lists, or do we go with the approach
> > I use in my patchset? It seems to me that the kernel-side code in my
> > patchset is not more complicated than your patchset is shaping up to
> > be, and some things are actually easier to accomplish, like having a
> > single idle_server_ptr vs this LAZY and/or server "preemption"
> > behavior that you have.
> >
> > Again, I'm OK with having it your way if all needed features are
> > covered, but I think we should be explicit about why
> > per-server/per-cpu model is chosen vs the one I proposed, especially
> > as it seems the kernel side code is not really simpler in the end.
>
> So I went with a UP first approach. I made single server preemption
> driven scheduling work first (both tick and wakeup-preemption are
> supported).
I agree that the UP approach is better than the LAZY one if we have
per-server/per-cpu worker queues.
>
> The whole LAZY thing is only meant to supress some of that (notably
> wakeup preemption), but you're right in that it's not really nice. I got
> it working, but I'm not particularly happy with it either.
>
> Having the sys_enter/sys_exit hooks also made the page pins short lived,
> and signals much simpler to handle. You're destroying signals IIUC.
>
>
> So I see no fundamental reason why userspace cannot do something like:
>
> struct umcg_task *current = NULL;
>
> for (;;) {
> self->state = UMCG_TASK_RUNNABLE | UMCG_TF_COND_WAIT;
>
> runnable_ptr = (void *)__atomic_exchange_n(&self->runnable_workers_ptr,
> NULL, __ATOMIC_SEQ_CST);
>
> pthread_mutex_lock(&global_queue.lock);
> while (runnable_ptr) {
> next = (void *)runnable_ptr->runnable_workers_ptr;
> enqueue_task(&global_queue, runnable_ptr);
> runnable_ptr = next;
> }
>
> /* complicated bit about current already running goes here */
>
> current = pick_task(&global_queue);
> self->next_tid = current ? current->tid : 0;
> unlock:
> pthread_mutex_unlock(&global_queue.lock);
>
> ret = sys_umcg_wait(0, 0);
>
> pthread_mutex_lock(&global_queue.lock);
> /* umcg_wait() didn't switch, make sure to return the task */
> if (self->next_tid) {
> enqueue_task(&global_queue, current);
> current = NULL;
> }
> pthread_mutex_unlock(&global_queue.lock);
>
> // do something with @ret
> }
>
> to get global scheduling and all the contention^Wgoodness related to it.
> Except, of course, it's more complicated, but I think the idea's clear
> enough.
Let me spend some time and see if I can make all of this work together
beyond simple tests. With the upcoming holidays and some other things
I am busy with, this may take more than a week, I'm afraid...
