I'm jumping into this particular branch of the conversation late. I've followed Doug's concerns against DKIM somewhat over the years. It seems fairly clear that Doug has a long-standing concern regarding DKIM and how it interacts with e-mail. It seems fairly clear he's in the rough within the IETF. If Doug is asking the IETF to get consensus behind his draft, that seems like it will be a hard sell. However, I strongly support writing down Doug's argument in a draft and assuming it is sufficiently coherent publishing it somewhere. I tend to think the ISR process of the RFC editor would do a good job evaluating the question of coherency and that the independent stream of the RFC series is a great place to publish the opinion of someone who has been involved in the process for a long time and still believes we've made a mistake. Sure, lots of people in the IETF will disagree with doug; that's what makes Doug in the rough. Interestingly, reading Dave's review and criticism of Doug's draft increases my confidence that there's something in what Doug has been thinking worth writing down and publishing. I think it's fine if Dave wants to write up his own draft about why Doug is wrong. So, I'd like to encourage Doug to refine his work, fix errors of precision, but to say I think this is worth writing down. --Sam