Dave, thats not what the text says... again: http://www.china-embassy.org/eng/hzqz/zgqz/t84247.htm Updated: 23/04/2009 Business Visa (F Visa) is issued to an alien who is invited to China for a visit, an investigation, a lecture, to do business, scientific-technological and culture exchanges, short-term advanced studies or internship for a period of no more than six months. .... so the questions on the table are: ) are IETF participants -invited- to China? if so, what for? ) a visit? ) a lecture? ) scientific-technological and culture exchanges? ) shorterm advanced studies? or do you view the IETF as something else? If IETF participants go to an IETF to; ) do business (making sales pitches, signing contracts, writing code **, or getting paid by locals) then perhaps Randy Bush's characterization of the new IETF is on target (IVTF). perhaps the more damming problem was raised by John K... Since, ostensibly, IETF participation is on an individual basis and folks (in theory) don't represent a company/corporate entity - it might be hard to get a recommendation letter - unless you want to write one for yourselves. ** guess this makes the "code sprint" prior to the meetings questionable. --bill On 24August2010Tuesday, at 8:51, Dave CROCKER wrote: > > > On 8/24/2010 8:28 AM, Mary Barnes wrote: >> My question then is whether you tell them at border control that you are >> attending a meeting or whether you are there on vacation. I am unfortunately >> not a good liar ;) > > > Let me get this straight. You are going to go to China and you are /not/ going to do ANY site-seeing? If the answer is yes, I think you have deeper problems than the visa... > > If you are doing some site-seeing, you are a tourist. Saying you are a tourist is, therefore, not lying. > > Are you planning on making sales pitches, signing contracts, getting paid by locals for work, writing code? The concern for business visas is that conduct of these sorts of business activities. That is, commerce. Merely having conversation that are work-related is not (really) conducting business. > > d/ > -- > > Dave Crocker > Brandenburg InternetWorking > bbiw.net > _______________________________________________ > Ietf mailing list > Ietf@xxxxxxxx > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf _______________________________________________ Ietf mailing list Ietf@xxxxxxxx https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf