RE: Removal of IETF patent disclosures?

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Understood.
/jim

> -----Original Message-----
> From: ietf-bounces@xxxxxxxx [mailto:ietf-bounces@xxxxxxxx] On
> Behalf Of Noel Chiappa
> Sent: Friday, August 15, 2008 10:34 AM
> To: ietf@xxxxxxxx
> Cc: jnc@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: RE: Removal of IETF patent disclosures?
>
>     > From: "Bound, Jim" <Jim.Bound@xxxxxx>
>
>     > I believe the IETF should not permit at some date in
> the future any
>     > part of a specification to have any IPR from any vendor that is
>     > accountable to patents or royalties. In simpler terms
> anything we
>     > develop in the IETF is public domain in the legal
> context, and we do
>     > not use any vendor patents for any of our work.
>
> This is impossible without a great deal of additional work,
> and an additional lengthy (multi-year delay), for reasons
> that I would have thought would have been obvious.
>
> The thing is that anyone can have a patent which bears on an
> IETF spec, and the holder of that patent might not even be
> active in the IETF. So the IETF could issue a spec, everyone
> could implement it, and once they've been selling gear for
> some months, people could get demand letters from someone
> we've never heard of.
>
> There is no easy way to detect such 'submarine' patents - and
> doing a lengthy search of all issued patents is not
> guaranteed to find such things either, as the patent in
> question may have been applied for, but not yet issued
> (various jurisdictions have differing rules on whether
> applications are made public).
>
> About the only thing that's relatively sure to ensure there
> are no patent issues is for the IETF to patent the spec, and
> see if the patent office allows the patent. If so, then
> you're _probably_ (but not necessarily, as the patent office
> does make mistakes fairly often) OK. Of course, that will add
> many years to our approval process.
>
>     > the base core IETF specs are patent, royalty, and IPR
> free to all
>     > worldwide regardless of geography or governmental boundaries.
>
> Now you've just multiplied the work by a factor of over 100,
> as each patent jurisdiction worldwide has its own set of patents.
>
>
>     > From: John C Klensin <john-ietf@xxxxxxx>
>
>     > I believe that the right way to handle these cases
> involves _not_
>     > having IPR submissions go directly to the database but
> instead be the
>     > subject of a nominal manual review  ...
>     > Being a little proactive in that way prevents nonsense
> from getting
>     > into the database in the first place and saves us
> discussions about the
>     > appropriate boundaries for removing something already posted.
>
> Excellent point.
>
>         Noel
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