Re: Last Call: draft-ietf-imapext-sort (INTERNET MESSAGE ACCESS PROTOCOL - SORT AND THREAD EXTENSIONS) to Proposed Standard

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On Mon Mar  3 15:03:20 2008, Cyrus Daboo wrote:
> --On March 2, 2008 11:07:50 PM -0800 Dan Karp <dkarp@xxxxxxxxxx>  
> wrote:
> 
>> The purpose of sorting in mail clients is so that users can find
>> messages they're looking for.
> 
> Actually you need to look at your use cases in more detail because  
> a lot of times searching is a much better solution than sorting.  
> e.g. the case of trying to find email from a particular person - a  
> search is much better. Yes you do have to do a little more work to  
> setup the search (type something in) rather than the single click  
> sorting requires, but on large mailboxes you will usually see what  
> you want immediately without having to scroll through the sorted  
> list looking for what you want.
> 
> 
I don't think Dan's saying that using SORT for searching is a good  
idea, but it's certainly what people do based on my observations,  
too. (In some clients, the sorted list is scrolled to whichever  
message was previously selected, so it's a fast way of finding other  
messages by the same person).


> For the most part I question why anyone would really want to sort  
> on any of the text fields. The only sort I have found useful is  
> sort by size - and then only to help in culling large messages when  
> my quota-limited mailboxes get full.

My client does no sorting at all, so I'm hard pressed to give any  
alternative use-cases. Generally, people seem to like sorting by date  
fields, though again not a text field. I've also seen people who like  
to sort by subject, essentially as a grouping thing - better done  
with threading, but still.

> View filtering can often be done with a single click (e.g.  
> option-click on the from address of a message currently in view  
> causes the view to show only those messages with that address).  
> This is far superior to sorting.

My client does the same (albeit with different clicks involved), and  
I too find it very useful. I'm not sure I'd say "far superior to  
sorting", since I don't see them as related, but I get your drift.

Still, though, the presence of useless SORT keys would only be a  
significant problem if they were especially difficult to implement,  
and the large deployments of SORT indicate that they're not. Even if  
it's only PINE, that's still a pretty vast number of users who may be  
relying on this behaviour.

When I last brought this up, I got the impression that it was  
considered by the vast majority that it was simply too late to change  
FROM to be useful.

Dave.
-- 
Dave Cridland - mailto:dave@xxxxxxxxxxxx - xmpp:dwd@xxxxxxxxxx
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