I haven't changed the subject. The correct subject is "sarcasm and intimidation". I have just provided specific examples of "sarcasm and intimidation" that have happened while working on spam issues for the IETF. Those specific exmaples fall under the topic of the subject header. Your complaint about subject change is frivolous. Nor am I playing rhetorical games with Noel Chiappa. I asked him a direct, relevant, specific question, and he didn't answer it. Instead he gave me a sarcastic, frivolous, and irrelevant response. The original story Chiappa gave about "Parry meets the Doctor" is often cited to mean: "Did I give you the impression I cared about your feelings?", which means that they don't care what you think. This is sarcasm, and is exactly what Hallam-Baker started to complain about under the topic "sarcasm and intimidation". The recent behavior by Carpenter and Chiappa has rather proved the point by Hallam-Baker, myself, and others. The frivolous complaints about message topic give the impression of intimidation. And I feel intimidated by the Chair's insistence on squelching the topic of "sarcasm and intimidation" and specifically any examples of sarcasm and intimidation involving IETF work on spam. So do others. This is inappropriate behavior by the current Chair, and by former IESG members. It is rather amazing that someone (a former IESG Member!) would be so brazen as to be sarcastic during a complaint about sarcasm and intimidation. Plainly, they seem to feel a right to be sarcastic. But I find no such right in the IETF or ISOC Code of Conduct, nor in the Mission Statement of the IETF. Just the opposite: One is expected to be courteous and respectful, and sarcasm is neither courteous nor respectful. A complaint on this inappropriate behavior is hereby brought to the attention of the IESG. Dean Anderson President Av8 Internet, Inc On Fri, 22 Jul 2005, Brian E Carpenter wrote: > ... > > Does this mean that you think the IETF should disband the ASRG, drop all > > current I-D's relating to spam, and quit working on spam issues? > > What I think is that if you change the subject, you should change > the Subject:, so that people who might be interested in "Sarcarm > and intimidation" but aren't interested in "Spam" don't waste their > time. > > Brian > > > _______________________________________________ > Ietf mailing list > Ietf@xxxxxxxx > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf > > -- Av8 Internet Prepared to pay a premium for better service? www.av8.net faster, more reliable, better service 617 344 9000 _______________________________________________ Ietf@xxxxxxxx https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf