> Times change. Today, using challenge response mechanisms such as Indeed, times do change. That's why is would be quite nice for the security community to take affirmative action and formulate consensus statements about mechanisms that are appropriate for particular scenarios. Having the rest of the community attempt to get its work done, including specifing security mechanisms as needed, and then have the security community come in and take shots at it, is not the way to run a productive process. In other words, the issue is not with the truth of your assertions but with the timing and place of them. d/ --- Dave Crocker Brandenburg InternetWorking +1.408.246.8253 dcrocker a t ... WE'VE MOVED to: www.bbiw.net _______________________________________________ Ietf@xxxxxxxx https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf