I'll finally bite inline Bill > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: RE: Voting (again) > From: jnc@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Noel Chiappa) > Date: Sat, April 16, 2005 6:22 pm > To: ietf@xxxxxxxx > Cc: jnc@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > > > From: "Hallam-Baker, Phillip" <pbaker@xxxxxxxxxxxx> > > OK, I'll bite... > > >> so in your mind, unless they kill off a lot of ADs, there's no > >> accountability? > > > There is not much accountability if they are unlikely to replace more > > than one AD who wanted to be reappointed. > > Why do you think a decent-sized, randomly-selected subset of the IETF (i.e. > the NomComm) are taking actions that are substantially more conservative (in > terms of keeping people) than the IETF as a whole would do? The *whole point* > of the NomComm is for it to have roughly the same views as the IETF as a > whole, except in a smaller body. So what makes you think that were the IETF > as a whole making the decisions, they'd be any different? This probably gets down to how everyone thinks the US congress is doing a bad job as a whole, but THEIR representative is doing great, so keeps reelecting them (well, in areas where the districts haven't been gerrymandered beyond all hope of a competative election). I really hope MOST ADs stay in the IESG for a LONG, LONG time - we need the group memory from ADs having been seated for a long time. This is a good thing. > > > Why do engineers believe that they are experts in innovating > > organizations? Is the result an improvement over traditional > > arrangements that have been incrementally improved over centuries? > > I find this comment particularly hilarious, in view of the fact that an > important part of the inspiration for the whole NomComm process was the > Athenian Constitution of 508 BC; in particular, the mechanism for the > selection of the Boule (the Council of Five Hundred), which was the chief > executive organ of the state. > > As you will perhaps recall, this constitution was in itself the result of > several hundred years of tinkering with democratic systems for use in small > societies with direct democracies (i.e. a very different environment from > today's mass representative democracies, with their millions of members). > > Noel > > _______________________________________________ > Ietf mailing list > Ietf@xxxxxxxx > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf _______________________________________________ Ietf@xxxxxxxx https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf