Hi,
First I deeply apologize for taking so long to respond, I just realized now these responses.
Yours,
Daniel
--
Daniel
On Tue, Oct 27, 2020 at 11:32 PM Sean Turner <sean@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> On Oct 27, 2020, at 10:32, Daniel Migault <mglt.ietf@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> To address the comment below, keeping weak security is likely to weaken current and future IoT communications, so I do not think there is room for compromise with performance. Of course this is in a context of TLS. I expect protocol to leverage from TLS security, so the impact should be rather negligible.
>
> """
> As those hash algorithms were 'cheap' for TLS 1.2, I would appreciate a review of impacted IoT protocols if those algorithms are deprecated.
> """
In terms of process, are you suggesting "a review of impacted IoT protocols if those algorithms are deprecated” MUST be completed prior to advancing this document to the IESG?
spt
> Yours,
> Daniel
>
>
> On Tue, Oct 27, 2020 at 10:21 AM Daniel Migault via Datatracker <noreply@xxxxxxxx> wrote:
> Reviewer: Daniel Migault
> Review result: Ready with Nits
>
> Hi,
>
>
> I reviewed this document as part of the IoT Directorate's ongoing effort to
> review all IETF documents being processed by the IESG. These comments were
> written primarily for the benefit of the Security Area Directors. Document
> authors, document editors, and WG chairs should treat these comments just like
> any other IETF Last Call comments.
>
> Review Results: Ready with Nits
>
> Please find my comments below.
>
> Yours,
> Daniel
>
>
> Deprecating MD5 and SHA-1 signature hashes in TLS 1.2
> draft-ietf-tls-md5-sha1-deprecate-04
> [...]
>
> 1. Introduction
>
> The usage of MD5 and SHA-1 for signature hashing in TLS 1.2 is
> specified in [RFC5246]. MD5 and SHA-1 have been proven to be
> insecure, subject to collision attacks [Wang]. In 2011, [RFC6151]
> detailed the security considerations, including collision attacks for
> MD5. NIST formally deprecated use of SHA-1 in 2011
> [NISTSP800-131A-R2] and disallowed its use for digital signatures at
> the end of 2013, based on both the Wang, et. al, attack and the
> potential for brute-force attack. In 2016, researchers from INRIA
> identified a new class of transcript collision attacks on TLS (and
> other protocols) that rely on efficient collision-finding algorithms
> on the underlying hash constructions [Transcript-Collision].
> Further, in 2017, researchers from Google and CWI Amsterdam
> [SHA-1-Collision] proved SHA-1 collision attacks were practical.
> This document updates [RFC5246] and [RFC7525] in such a way that MD5
> and SHA-1 MUST NOT be used for digital signatures. However, this
> document does not deprecate SHA-1 in HMAC for record protection.
>
> <mglt>
> RFC6194 may be mentioned as a reference for
> not deprecating HMAC-SHA-1 as well as an
> additional reference to [NISTSP800-131A-R2].
>
> Reading the text the situation of HMAC with
> MD5 is unclear. Since we specify that SHA-1
> is not deprecated for HMAC we may specify
> the status for HMAC with MD5. Given RFC6151 I
> hope the reason is that MD5 and HMAC-MD5 has
> already been deprecated but I have not found
> this. Maybe that would worth mentioning it
> is deprecated already.
>
> </mglt>
>
> [...]
>
> 2. Signature Algorithms
>
> Clients MUST NOT include MD5 and SHA-1 in the signature_algorithms
> extension. If a client does not send a signature_algorithms
> extension, then the server MUST abort the handshake and send a
> handshake_failure alert, except when digital signatures are not used
> (for example, when using PSK ciphers).
>
> <mglt>
> It seems to me that the server behavior might
> be defined as well. In our case this could be
> something around the lines the server MUST
> ignore MD5 and SHA1 values in the signature
> algorithm extension.
>
> </mglt>
>
> 3. Certificate Request
>
> Servers SHOULD NOT include MD5 and SHA-1 in CertificateRequest
> messages.
>
> <mglt>
> It seems to me that the same level of
> authentication should be provided for both
> peers and that server MUST NOT include MD5
> or SHA-1.
>
> A SHOULD NOT status might be welcome for a
> smooth transition. At that time, collision
> for MD5 and SHA1 are known for years. It is likely
> that software that still need MD5 or SHA1 are
> likely to never upgrade, so I doubt a smooth
> path worth being taken.
> </mglt>
>
> 4. Server Key Exchange
>
> Servers MUST NOT include MD5 and SHA-1 in ServerKeyExchange messages.
> If a client receives a MD5 or SHA-1 signature in a ServerKeyExchange
> message it MUST abort the connection with the illegal_parameter
> alert.
>
> <mglt>
> As per section 2, the client has clearly
> indicated it does not support signature with
> MD5/SHA1, so Server Key Exchange should not
> end up with signature with SHA1/MD5.
>
> """
> If the client has offered the "signature_algorithms" extension, the
> signature algorithm and hash algorithm MUST be a pair listed in that
> extension.
> """
>
> It also seems to me that the constraint of
> including a MD5 and SHA-1 signature is
> related to the Certificate. I suspect that
> some clarification are needed here.
>
> Since the case where the extension becomes
> mandatory, the quoted text above of RFC 5246
> might be updated as well, though this does
> not appear that necessary.
>
> </mglt>
>
> 5. Certificate Verify
>
> Clients MUST NOT include MD5 and SHA-1 in CertificateVerify messages.
> If a server receives a CertificateVerify message with MD5 or SHA-1 it
> MUST abort the connection with handshake_failure or
> insufficient_security alert.
>
>
> <mglt>
>
> 6. Certificate
>
> Unless I am missing something, it seems to me
> that signature may also be found in the
> Certificate messages for the chain as well in
> the restriction of the signature algorithm.
> The end certificate is associated to the peer
> while other certificate are related to a CA.
>
> It seems that client and server behavior may
> be specified. The quoted text below may be
> helpful to clarify.
>
> """
> If the client provided a "signature_algorithms" extension, then all
> certificates provided by the server MUST be signed by a
> hash/signature algorithm pair that appears in that extension.
> """
>
> </mglt>
>
> 6. Updates to RFC5246
>
> [RFC5246], The Transport Layer Security (TLS) Protocol Version 1.2,
> suggests that implementations can assume support for MD5 and SHA-1 by
> their peer. This update changes the suggestion to assume support for
> SHA-256 instead, due to MD5 and SHA-1 being deprecated.
>
> In Section 7.4.1.4.1: the text should be revised from:
>
> OLD:
>
> "Note: this is a change from TLS 1.1 where there are no explicit
> rules, but as a practical matter one can assume that the peer
> supports MD5 and SHA- 1."
>
> NEW:
>
> "Note: This is a change from TLS 1.1 where there are no explicit
> rules, but as a practical matter one can assume that the peer
> supports SHA-256."
>
>
> <mglt>
> I am reading the Note as an explanation on
> why sha was taken as the default hash
> function with the following rules.
>
> """
> If the client does not send the signature_algorithms extension, the
> server MUST do the following:
>
> - If the negotiated key exchange algorithm is one of (RSA, DHE_RSA,
> DH_RSA, RSA_PSK, ECDH_RSA, ECDHE_RSA), behave as if client had
> sent the value {sha1,rsa}.
>
> - If the negotiated key exchange algorithm is one of (DHE_DSS,
> DH_DSS), behave as if the client had sent the value {sha1,dsa}.
>
> - If the negotiated key exchange algorithm is one of (ECDH_ECDSA,
> ECDHE_ECDSA), behave as if the client had sent value {sha1,ecdsa}.
> """
>
> The current document does not update the
> default hash function from sha to sha256 to
> avoid interoperability issue where one peer
> takes sha while the other one takes sha-256.
> As a results, these rules and the "Note" may
> eventually all together be replaced by your
> text of section 2.
>
> The following text may also be removed:
>
> """
> If the client supports only the default hash and signature algorithms
> (listed in this section), it MAY omit the signature_algorithms
> extension.
> """
>
> Regarding the Note, it seems to be that the
> removal of support for MD5/SHA1 will result
> in interoperability issues. At this point,
> the issue is due to the obsolescence of the
> implementation as deprecation of SHA1/Md5 has
> started a long time ago.
>
> It is unclear to me how normative is
> interpreted "can assume". Was the support of
> MD5/SHA1 a SHOULD or a MUST? In both case, if
> we were willing to maintain interoperability
> between software that only implemented
> MD5/SHA1, we should take a slower path and
> introducing SHA-256 and having were MD5/SHA1
> kept for interoperability purpose before
> being deprecated. I do not think we should
> take that path as implementations that
> currently do not support SHA-256 are unlikely
> to be updated and that deprecation of
> SHA1/MD5 has started a long time ago.
>
> I would however mention the issue of
> interoperability in the section but not in
> the text to update. In the text to update I
> would maybe suggest that the support of
> SHA-256 comes with a normative MUST
> statement.
>
>
> </mglt>
>
> Velvindron, et al. Expires April 12, 2021 [Page 3]
>
> Internet-Draft draft-ietf-tls-md5-sha1-deprecate October 2020
>
>
> 7. Updates to RFC7525
>
> [RFC7525], Recommendations for Secure Use of Transport Layer Security
> (TLS) and Datagram Transport Layer Security (DTLS) recommends use of
> SHA-256 as a minimum requirement. This update moves the minimum
> recommendation to use stronger language deprecating use of both SHA-1
> and MD5. The prior text did not explicitly include MD5 or SHA-1; and
> this text adds guidance to ensure that these algorithms have been
> deprecated..
>
> Section 4.3:
>
> OLD:
>
> When using RSA, servers SHOULD authenticate using certificates with
> at least a 2048-bit modulus for the public key. In addition, the use
> of the SHA-256 hash algorithm is RECOMMENDED (see [CAB-Baseline] for
> more details). Clients SHOULD indicate to servers that they request
> SHA-256, by using the "Signature Algorithms" extension defined in TLS
> 1.2.
>
> NEW:
>
> Servers SHOULD authenticate using certificates with at least a
> 2048-bit modulus for the public key.
>
> In addition, the use of the SHA-256 hash algorithm is RECOMMENDED;
> and SHA-1 or MD5 MUST NOT be used (see [CAB-Baseline] for more
> details). Clients MUST indicate to servers that they request SHA-
> 256, by using the "Signature Algorithms" extension defined in TLS
> 1.2.
>
> <mglt>
> I understand the reason we do specify that
> hash algorithms that MUST NOT been used. This
> is fine in the context of this document, but
> it seems to me that if we were writing the
> updated specification we may have rather
> mentioned a minimum level of security hash
> function needs to be met - in our case
> SHA-256. I leave the co-authors make the
> appropriated choice.
>
> </mglt>
>
>
> 8. IANA Considerations
>
> The document updates the "TLS SignatureScheme" registry to change the
> recommended status of SHA-1 based signature schemes to N (not
> recommended) as defined by [RFC8447]. The following entries are to
> be updated:
>
> +--------+----------------+-------------+-------------------+
> | Value | Description | Recommended | Reference |
> +--------+----------------+-------------+-------------------+
> | 0x0201 | rsa_pkcs1_sha1 | N | [RFC8446][RFCTBD] |
> | 0x0203 | ecdsa_sha1 | N | [RFC8446][RFCTBD] |
> +--------+----------------+-------------+-------------------+
>
> Other entries of the resgistry remain the same.
>
>
> <mglt>
> It seems to me that TLS 1.2 is using the TLS
> hash and TLS signature registry TLS signature
> registry and TLS 1.3 is using Signature
> Scheme.
>
> I suspect that TLS hash values for sha1 and
> md5 should be deprecated. And RFCTBD should
> be added for sha1 and md5. Note that the
> SHOULD NOT status for CertificateRequest
> may have prevented such deprecation.
>
> A side effect is these code points for
> signature scheme that were assigned for
> compatibility with legacy (TLS 1.2)
> signatures must not be used anymore - if
> there are no more valid with TLS 1.2.
> </mglt>
>
>
>
>
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>
>
> --
> Daniel Migault
> Ericsson
Daniel Migault
Ericsson
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