RE: PKIs and trust

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Comments in-line, prefaced by my initials "AWA".

		Al Arsenault


> -----Original Message-----
> From: Masataka Ohta [mailto:mohta@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
> Sent: Monday, December 15, 2003 2:15 PM
> To: Al Arsenault
> Cc: Franck Martin; Paul Hoffman / IMC; Keith Moore; ietf@xxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: PKIs and trust
>
>
> Al Arsenault;
>
> > Having worked in the "PKI" field for a loooonnnnggg time now,
>
> Where can I find an authoritative reference on what "PKI", by
> your definition, means?
>

AWA:  See, for example
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-pkix-roadmap-09.txt

>From Section 1.2:

	Public Key Infrastructure (PKI) - The set of hardware, software,
       people, policies and procedures needed to create, manage, store,
       distribute, and revoke PKCs based on public-key cryptography.

Note that there's nothing in there about USING the keys/certificates to
accomplish any particular (business or other) task.  In other words, the
applications are external to the PKI.

Section 2 of that draft has some more details.


> > 	- unfortunately, many people when hearing the phrase "public key
> > infrastructure" thinks that that is what is meant/required,
> even though most
> > of us working in the field know that it's not required.
>
> That's a fair statement, if you can clarify what, then, are required.
>
> > (From personal experience, my belief is that the single biggest
> failure of
> > PKI is the over-hyping and under-delivering of the technology.
> People were
> > led to believe that once they had a PKI, their problems were
> solved.  That's
> > not the case. I used to hate working with people who had bought
> a PKI from
> > somebody, not understanding that all they really needed then were the
> > applications that let used the PKI/certificate stuff to do
> business they way
> > they wanted to do it.  The only thing worse was when I worked for a PKI
> > company, and had to work with a customer to whom our
> sales-critters had just
> > made a sale.  To start a conversation with "Joe didn't tell you
> you still
> > need..." wasn't fun.)
>
> It seems to me that you think PKI not only exists but also
> can be purchased.

AWA:  Hmm - my terminology in my original posting was a bit suboptimal.
*Part* of the PKI can be purchased - namely, the hardware and software.  The
"people, policies, and procedures" bits get tricky - you generally cannot
buy them. (You can often buy "generic" policies and procedures manuals that
have to be tailored to your specific environment/rules, but you can't buy a
canned solution.) Those are also the parts over which many folk who have
tried to implement PKI have stumbled. In the original message, I should have
said "PKI hardware/software" or similar terms, rather than "a PKI".  Mea
culpa.

And, of course, the actual applications/business processes still have to be
provided from somewhere else.

>
> So, where can I find your definition of "PKI"?
>
> URLs please.
>
> 							Masataka Ohta
>



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