00:01:03 <Sparks> #startmeeting Docs Project Meeting - Agenda: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs_Project_meetings 00:01:03 <zodbot> Meeting started Thu Oct 8 00:01:03 2009 UTC. The chair is Sparks. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 00:01:03 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 00:01:09 <Sparks> #topic Roll Call 00:01:11 * Sparks 00:01:23 * jjmcd is here 00:01:44 * bcotton is here (who is this guy anyway) 00:01:54 <jjmcd> And according to my watch, you were within a couple seconds, probably IRC lag 00:02:04 * danielsmw is here 00:02:27 * Sparks wants to shoot the guy who schedules a meeting in the middle of an amateur radio contest! 00:02:48 <jjmcd> There's always a contest 00:02:50 <ianweller> i wonder who that was 00:02:56 <Sparks> :) 00:03:10 <Sparks> 70cm is dead anyway 00:04:40 <Sparks> Okay, let's get started... 00:04:46 <Sparks> #topic Old Business 00:05:10 <Sparks> danielsmw: What the status on the editor for Zikula? 00:05:37 <danielsmw> Sparks: i've been working on it for the past hour 00:05:42 <Sparks> :) 00:05:45 <danielsmw> Sparks: rpmlint comes out clean now 00:05:53 <Sparks> danielsmw: Very cool! 00:05:55 <danielsmw> so I think i may go ahead and put it on bugzilla 00:06:25 <danielsmw> Yup. 00:06:30 <Sparks> Excellent. 00:06:48 <Sparks> Let us know if you need any support. 00:06:55 <Sparks> Thanks for packaging it! 00:07:01 <danielsmw> Sparks: Will do. I probably will later this evening 00:07:04 <danielsmw> No problem1 00:07:54 <Sparks> rudi: I see you changed the license info on the Fedora brand package for Publican 00:08:14 <rudi> Yep -- all done 00:08:41 <Sparks> rudi: Excellent 00:08:42 <jjmcd> rudi, does that also include the additional localization? 00:08:51 <rudi> jjmcd -- kinda 00:08:57 <Sparks> ianweller: Did you figure out how to change the license on the wiki? 00:09:02 <rudi> It includes the feedback file 00:09:08 <ianweller> Sparks: it's in localsettings.php 00:09:10 <ianweller> which is in puppet 00:09:17 <Sparks> ianweller: So you are good to go? 00:09:19 <rudi> But "Document Conventions" is part of the publican package 00:09:26 <rudi> not the Fedora brand package. 00:09:35 <ianweller> Sparks: sure i'll work on a patch sometime tonight and test it somewhere 00:09:37 <jjmcd> That seems odd 00:10:08 <rudi> (I also missed 4 languages in the package I released the other day, there's a corrected package in Bodhi now that should appear soon to fix that) 00:10:36 <jjmcd> All the langs except Chinese are now building 00:10:48 <rudi> Well, since "Document Conventions" documents how Publican renders various XML tags, this doesn't tend to change from brand to brand. 00:12:03 <rudi> If someone came up with a very heavily customized brand that *did* change how those tags were rendered, they could also create a new "Document Conventions" text to ship with that package 00:12:42 <rudi> Which would override the one in Common_Content/common 00:13:11 <rudi> Anyway, I'll see if I can package the extra "Document Conventions" translations into a new release of Publican 0.44 for us 00:13:33 <jjmcd> good deal 00:14:52 <Sparks> Okay... 00:15:01 <Sparks> #topic Status on CMS (Zikula) 00:15:15 <Sparks> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Zikula#Module_status 00:15:21 <Sparks> Can anyone provide an update? 00:16:36 <Sparks> Well, I know danielsmw will be submitting the editor for Zikula for review tonight. 00:16:44 <danielsmw> Yup. 00:17:13 <Sparks> Anyone else have an update? 00:17:36 <Sparks> Okay, moving on 00:17:42 <Sparks> #topic Status on CC license rollout. 00:17:50 <Sparks> * #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/License_changeover_schedule 00:17:54 <Sparks> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/License_changeover_schedule 00:18:19 <jjmcd> kudos to ianweller for his announcement and notoriety 00:18:20 <Sparks> I think ianweller sent out the announcement on Monday. 00:18:29 <Sparks> ianweller: Have you received any feedback? 00:18:34 <ianweller> no 00:18:36 <jjmcd> Sparks, showed up in LWN 00:18:41 <Sparks> Cool 00:18:55 <ianweller> i am looking into the wiki crap at the moment if anybody's wondering 00:19:23 <jjmcd> Just reach into your bucket of magic pixie dust 00:19:31 <Sparks> I think quaid was working on contacting previous contributors 00:20:27 <Sparks> ianweller: do you have a link for that LWN article? 00:20:45 * ianweller looksies 00:21:02 <Sparks> I think the big thing is going to be #7... Make changes to the guides. Rebuild all current versions and push them to docs.fp.o and repos. (All) 00:21:04 <ianweller> http://lwn.net/Articles/355546/ 00:21:15 <ianweller> they just copy/pasted my emai 00:21:17 <ianweller> email* 00:21:22 <Sparks> That means that all guides will need to be updated ASAP. 00:21:47 <Sparks> ianweller++ 00:22:24 <Sparks> This will be coming up in the near future. 00:23:02 <rudi> I feel a world of CVS hurt a-comin :) 00:23:02 <Sparks> #action Sparks to send to the list an action request to all guide leaders for update status of the license 00:23:09 <Sparks> rudi: Yeah 00:23:17 * danielsmw is afk for a bit 00:23:35 <Sparks> Okay, anything else on this topic? 00:23:54 <rudi> Are we just republishing F11 docs? 00:23:59 <rudi> Or further back too? 00:24:31 <Sparks> rudi: I think just F11. 00:24:36 <rudi> +1 !!!!!! 00:24:44 <Sparks> F10 will be EOL soon anyway. 00:24:54 <Sparks> rudi: Unless you want to go back to the FC days. :) 00:25:14 <rudi> Uh.... 00:25:20 <rudi> NO 00:25:23 <rudi> :) 00:25:28 <Sparks> IMO if people are going to want to use some of our information they would probably want to get it from the latest source and not an old guide. 00:25:52 * Sparks thinks ianweller got off easy during this ordeal 00:26:07 <Sparks> Okay, moving on. 00:26:13 <Sparks> #topic Shared open-source style guide 00:26:21 <Sparks> #link https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-docs-list/2009-June/msg00163.html 00:26:28 <Sparks> Does anyone have an update on this? 00:26:58 <Sparks> Going... 00:27:01 <Sparks> going... 00:27:07 <Sparks> gone. 00:27:09 <rudi> Still blocked by the NotEnoughHoursInTheDay bug 00:27:17 <Sparks> rudi: Understood. 00:27:26 <rudi> Expect some traction after I finish on the Publican 1.0 User Guide :) 00:27:36 <Sparks> rudi: You might want to shoot ke4qqq an email on this as I think he wanted to work on it but probably has the same bug. 00:27:38 <rudi> (RSN) 00:27:52 <Sparks> #topic Guide needs? 00:27:58 * ianweller hsa to run 00:28:01 <Sparks> Okay, anyone have any guides that are in need? 00:28:10 <rudi> Sure -- my blocker is getting the content together that legal has agreed to release to the wider community 00:28:10 <Sparks> ianweller: Cya 00:28:21 <jjmcd> I sent a wuery to qrplinux-L looking for help 00:28:24 <jjmcd> no joy 00:28:38 <jjmcd> I think I will ping QRP-L, a much bigger list 00:28:39 <bcotton> the RPM guide might need a new owner, i am ashamed to admit that I havent done squat with it all summer :-/ 00:28:40 <Sparks> jjmcd: On the Amateur Radio guide? 00:28:45 <jjmcd> affirm 00:28:59 <jjmcd> bcotton: same bug as rudi? 00:29:05 <Sparks> jjmcd: Okay. I need to take a stab at some of it. 00:29:31 <bcotton> jjmcd: a combo of that and NotEnoughExperience 00:29:32 <Sparks> rudi: Which guide is this that you are having legal issues on? 00:29:34 <jjmcd> Sparks, it would be nice to have something fairly complete for F12 00:29:52 <Sparks> jjmcd: Might be too late in the game 00:30:12 <jjmcd> could be 00:30:15 <rudi> No guide -- I got left behind -- I was still talking about the Open Source Style Guide 00:30:25 <Sparks> rudi: Ahhh 00:30:26 <rudi> (and Red Hat's internal Style guidelines) 00:30:35 <Sparks> rudi: understood 00:30:53 <Sparks> bcotton: What do you need? More help or more time or both? 00:31:39 <jjmcd> bcotton, you might be able to get some help from Florian. He asked us to do it, probably could provide content guidance 00:31:57 <bcotton> Sparks: a bit of both. i'm taking a new job later this month, which should give me a bit more time once i get settled. i'll also get more experience with git and rpm building, and so forth 00:32:23 <Sparks> bcotton: Put the word out on the f-docs-l and see if there are any takers. 00:32:59 <bcotton> sparks: to help or to take? i'd be okay with either. i know the guide is rather dated, but i dont want to let it languish any more than it needs to 00:33:23 <Sparks> bcotton: Whichever you feel most comfortable. You'd probably find helpers first, though. 00:33:35 <bcotton> (i'll also try to hang out in the IRC channel more, i've been fairly absent for a while) 00:33:44 <bcotton> sparks: can do! 00:33:44 <Sparks> Okay 00:33:51 <Sparks> jjmcd and rudi: How goes the RNs? 00:33:58 <jjmcd> Well, 00:34:14 <jjmcd> I need one small edit before I make the beta rpm 00:34:29 <jjmcd> Next move I guess is to update docs.fp.o 00:34:46 <rudi> jjmcd -- I've been doing that as langs hit 100% 00:34:57 <jjmcd> We have been building every night anf the L10N gang has been working hard 00:35:14 <Sparks> excellent 00:35:23 <rudi> A couple of thoughts: 00:35:57 <rudi> 1) this time, I think we should only move langs to d.fp.o if there's been L10N work in the current cycle 00:36:25 <rudi> 2) langs should remain "Drafts" until they hit 100% 00:37:04 <rudi> I think we're getting to the point where we should present readers with something a bit more polished 00:37:19 <rudi> Some of you may have seen the French L10N team take a firm stand on this recently ;) 00:37:35 <jjmcd> Last time there were a lot of langs at 80-90%, shouldn't we pull the trigger on those? Or should we encourage the translators to move that last few percent. 00:37:37 <Sparks> I didn't 00:37:43 <Sparks> rudi: Can you elaborate? 00:37:56 <rudi> (They nuked the entire F12 RN fr.po file because they didn't want to see mishmashed docs published) 00:38:10 <rudi> (and don't have plans to translate the F12 RN) 00:38:39 <rudi> jjmcd -- I think we need to provide the encouragement to squeeze out that last 10%-20% 00:39:15 <Sparks> rudi: So let me get this straight... There were French translations and they removed them all? 00:39:26 <rudi> Sparks -- yes 00:39:35 <rudi> French translations carried over from previous cycles 00:39:37 <Sparks> rudi: That's not going to sit well with me at all. 00:39:44 <rudi> For headings and stuff 00:39:52 <Sparks> rudi: Why did they do that? 00:40:00 <Sparks> What was the reasoning? 00:40:21 <rudi> Sparks -- because they saw us (docs) publishing half-complete work in the past and didn't want it to happen again 00:40:29 <jjmcd> Sounds so terribly French of them 00:40:30 <ryanlerch> rudi: what was the % translated when they nuked it? 00:40:33 <Sparks> so they aren't going to do them at all? 00:40:49 <rudi> Sparks -- they have no plans to for F12 00:40:57 <Sparks> I'm not good with that 00:41:43 <rudi> ryanlerch -- only about 10%–20% 00:41:47 <rudi> Reused strings. 00:42:08 <Sparks> Okay... anything else? 00:42:19 <rudi> It does mean, however, that if they decide that they want to do RN in French for (say) F13, they'll need to rebase the PO to F10 00:42:28 <rudi> (or start from scratch, as they choose) 00:42:49 <Sparks> That's just nuts 00:43:12 <rudi> True, but they probably didn't realise that they could just ask us not to publish the doc ;) 00:43:32 <Sparks> I'll keep my thoughts to myself at the moment. 00:43:34 <rudi> And, I sympathise with their desire not to publish half-finished work to the world 00:43:40 <Sparks> Okay, moving on. 00:43:47 <Sparks> Anything else in the guide department? 00:44:17 <Sparks> #topic New guides? 00:44:28 <Sparks> Any new guides to be discussed? 00:44:39 <jjmcd> You don't have enough? 00:44:56 <Sparks> I don't have enough time to work on the guides I want to work on! 00:44:58 <Sparks> :) 00:45:06 <Sparks> #topic Other business 00:45:09 <rudi> Just noting that the Virt Guide is up 00:45:14 <Sparks> Anyone have anything else they want to talk about? 00:45:18 <Sparks> rudi: +1 00:45:21 <rudi> On the F12 drafts page 00:45:23 <jjmcd> Sparks 00:45:24 <rudi> Check it out! :) 00:45:36 <jjmcd> You are aware that the beta meeting moved a week 00:45:46 <Sparks> jjmcd: Yes... Was going to mention that to you... :) 00:46:12 <jjmcd> :-) Poelstra sent me a note, I wasn't sure it also went to you 00:46:41 <Sparks> jjmcd: I saw it on the logistics list. Are you on that? 00:46:56 <jjmcd> Not sure, don't think so 00:47:05 <jjmcd> I already have too many lists 00:47:24 <Sparks> Okay, that list was created as a joint list kinda thing... mutual aid? 00:48:17 <Sparks> Okay, anything else? 00:48:21 <jjmcd> Yep, the note from JP was posted to logistics so I guess I am on it 00:48:38 <Sparks> I actually have something. 00:49:11 <Sparks> The first meeting after the F12 release I'll accept nominations for "leader" of the Docs Project. 00:49:27 <Sparks> We'll give that a week and then we'll have a poll setup to vote. 00:49:47 <Sparks> So be thinking of someone you'd like to see running this thing. 00:50:02 <Sparks> I think it is a good idea to do this every release or two... 00:50:12 <jjmcd> I don't know if you can get out of it that easy 00:50:15 <Sparks> just to keep the ideas new and the momentum moving. 00:50:23 <Sparks> jjmcd: One can try. 00:50:36 <Sparks> jjmcd: All I have to do is nominate you. :) 00:50:43 * ryanlerch nominates zodbot, he is always in meetings... 00:50:55 <rudi> lolz@ryanlerch 00:50:56 <Sparks> ryanlerch: That's true. And he does take really good notes. 00:50:59 * bcotton seconds ryanlerch's nomination 00:51:02 <jjmcd> I'll decline, but maybe I should nominate EvilBob, he is always at these meetngs, too 00:51:31 <bcotton> but here's a question: why can't zodbot be a she? 00:51:43 <EvilBob> that is what I get for having a good bouncer 00:51:45 <Sparks> bcotton: zodbot sounds too masculine 00:51:59 <jjmcd> what about Sonar_Gal? 00:52:26 <jjmcd> Always coming and going 00:52:41 <Sparks> :) 00:52:45 <Sparks> Okay, anything else? 00:53:12 <danielsmw> ls 00:53:16 * danielsmw apologizes 00:53:40 <Sparks> rm -Ir danielsmw 00:53:43 <jjmcd> better than firefox http://myfavepornsite & 00:54:26 <Sparks> 5 00:54:31 <Sparks> 4 00:54:35 <Sparks> 3 00:54:39 <Sparks> 2 00:54:44 <Sparks> 1 00:54:49 <Sparks> Thanks everyone for coming! 00:54:56 <Sparks> #endmeeting -- fedora-docs-list mailing list fedora-docs-list@xxxxxxxxxx To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-docs-list
