On 4/25/08, Les Mikesell <lesmikesell@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: > Suren Karapetyan wrote: > >>> > >>> That solution has already been subscribed in the thread over and > >>> over, symlink the tools that make sense from */sbin/ to */bin/ and be > >>> done with it. It will solve all issues in both camps and we can carry > >>> on. > >> > >> If you don't take them all, how does this solve the problem that 'su' > >> vs. 'su -' will still not have all the same things included in your > >> path? Personally, I'd rather see everything moved to /bin and > >> /usr/bin with /sbin and /user/sbin changed to compatibility symlinks, > >> but that can only be done cleanly during a new install (or maybe > >> wrapped in a reboot). > >> > > I don't quite understand why "su" and "su -" should be doing the same > > thing. > > What's the point in "-" if they should do the same? > > They shouldn't be doing the same thing, but (a) that's an obscure point > that a new user should not have to learn while he's trying to fix some > other problem if you don't want them to hate linux, and (b) when you do > know the difference you may not really want it to happen. > > > BTW tweaking PATH or symlinking stuff from */sbin into */bin or merger > > won't make "su" behave like "su -". > > That's not what I want. I want to be able to run the programs that > someone arbitrarily decided should live in /sbin or /usr/sbin without > having to know that they are in /sbin or /usr/sbin (or who decided that, > or when or why), _and_ without changing my working directory. > > > Personally I'm happy doing "su" then "make install" if I don't want to > > change cwd and my exports (CFLAGS?) and aliases and doing "su -" to do > > some tweaking with iptables, ip, tc, dhcpd, asterisk... > > I've never liked the Ubuntu way of doing things. The first thing I did > > on any Ubuntu system I had to use was "sudo passwd; su -" > > On Ubuntu (and Mac, etc.) just 'sudo su -' to get a reasonable root > shell. If you drink the sudo kool-aid, that at least makes sense but it > will still change your cwd. > > > And also: I've never had */sbin in the PATH of my non-root user. > > Isn't the first thing they ask you always 'why can't I run ifconfig To be honest I've never been asked that. Maybe it's the result of me telling my "students" to use root (doing "su -") when tweaking the system and not use it for anything else. But I still agree with You about ifconfig. It's the only thing I use from */sbin as a normal user (at least I can't remember anything else). > (or fdisk, And I still can't understand what's the point of running fdisk as a normal user. > etc.)'? And I'm still waiting to be told what other tools are in "etc" > Why confuse > them with things the PATH mechanism was > designed to take care of transparently for you? > > -- > Les Mikesell > lesmikesell@xxxxxxxxx > > -- > fedora-devel-list mailing list > fedora-devel-list@xxxxxxxxxx > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list > -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@xxxxxxxxxx https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
